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Just take away the guns, do it now Options · View
Guest
Posted: Sunday, December 16, 2012 3:54:24 PM

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sprite wrote:


probably cause i don't recall an incident where 28 people at an elementary school were beaten to death by a single man armed with a baseball bat. do you?

True but let's remember the guns this guy had we're stolen, they weren't even his. Let me just say I do feel for the victims and their families, this is a tragedy but if there was one person there who legally possessed a gun a lot of people may have been saved.
sprite
Posted: Sunday, December 16, 2012 3:56:56 PM

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jillinjulie wrote:
An odd perspective, but I have a concealed carry permit as part of my job as a jeweler who transports valuable merchandise.
Trained extensively; but hope never ever to have a confrontation.
Lest I do, I have a first line of defense to protect my life and maybe others.
Not everyone is in the same situation as I so I do not expect support.


1. Some jobs require extenuating circumstances. i don't expect Brink's/armored car drivers or bank guards to go unarmed either. it's part of the job. School teachers, on the other hand, shouldn't be armed.

2. personally, i'd rather have someone take away whatever it was i was carrying rather than be shot or shoot someone else. Nothing material is worth either of those outcomes. i don't want the responsibility of making a mistake and using a gun when it wasn't warranted. Trayvon Martin and Oscar Grant come to mind quite readily. If a life is in danger, than yes, but dammit, you've been trained, as you say. you carry one on the job. that's different than somebody deciding they need a bunch of semi automatics stuffed in their closet and under their bed. i would guess that you don't carry a gun when you're at the mall shopping, am i right?

http://www.lushstories.com/stories/hardcore/west-coast-games-part-one-the-beach.aspx
Guest
Posted: Sunday, December 16, 2012 3:59:34 PM

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I was shot for those who don't know, and almost died. I would rather have a fighting chance than not have the choice.
sprite
Posted: Sunday, December 16, 2012 4:02:57 PM

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beeper726 wrote:

True but let's remember the guns this guy had we're stolen, they weren't even his. Let me just say I do feel for the victims and their families, this is a tragedy but if there was one person there who legally possessed a gun a lot of people may have been saved.


or not. don't forget, the shooter was wearing a bullet proof vest. to my knowledge, the point of those are to deflect bullets. so, someone shoots him, it leaves a bruise, The shooter guns them down. what would that have solved?

http://www.lushstories.com/stories/hardcore/west-coast-games-part-one-the-beach.aspx
sprite
Posted: Sunday, December 16, 2012 4:06:43 PM

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beeper726 wrote:
I was shot for those who don't know, and almost died. I would rather have a fighting chance than not have the choice.


i was knifed. i had pepper spray. i didn't have a chance to use it. i wouldn't have had a chance to use a gun, either, though he certainly could have once he took it away from me. i'm wish i could have gotten away - that would have been my only goal - buy me enough time to run. failing that, i went passive, i LET him do what he did to me cause i'd rather live with the nightmares than be dead. after everything, i am STILL against people running around with guns.

http://www.lushstories.com/stories/hardcore/west-coast-games-part-one-the-beach.aspx
Guest
Posted: Sunday, December 16, 2012 4:42:45 PM

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OK my last opinion maybe what i am trying to say is a mechanical instrument can not do anything on its own. We are much too kind to ppl who misuse things. Case in point a Dallas Cowboy kills a teammate while driving drunk. He needs to be supported. He needs to have it made clear to him the thing that he did but yu cant punish the company who made the booze he drank they arent responsible. I am a teacher now that i was told we were not needed as a therapist (cough cough)<stated that already> the one thing we dont teach in school is responsibility we protect we never let people fall and when something does happen we slap them on the wrist and ask that they dont d it again bu tthere is n real consequence. there are things that i do in my life that my close friends know about. I swear i wil never do it again but if i really wnat to I will i will find a way to do it so when you say a mechanical object is responsible for a persons logical or illogical actions is ridiculous. GM or Ford can not take responsibility for some idiot running through a shopping mall full of christmas shoppers. Rach I am not angry except that people are not held responsibile for there actions. And Hitler was crazy do you think if he was told h couldnt kill the opposition that would have stopped him? Please dont tell me McVeigh wasnt mentally unstable. He was OBSESSED that in itself is is a mental problem when that is all he thinks about. What he did wasnt psychotic? Please tell me how many Sane ppl you know would do that. And btw i realize that snity is not a medical term its a legal term. lets stop arguing apples and oranges

Guest
Posted: Sunday, December 16, 2012 5:18:11 PM

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Angie57 wrote:
OK my last opinion maybe what i am trying to say is a mechanical instrument can not do anything on its own. We are much too kind to ppl who misuse things. Case in point a Dallas Cowboy kills a teammate while driving drunk. He needs to be supported. He needs to have it made clear to him the thing that he did but yu cant punish the company who made the booze he drank they arent responsible. I am a teacher now that i was told we were not needed as a therapist (cough cough)<stated that already> the one thing we dont teach in school is responsibility we protect we never let people fall and when something does happen we slap them on the wrist and ask that they dont d it again bu tthere is n real consequence. there are things that i do in my life that my close friends know about. I swear i wil never do it again but if i really wnat to I will i will find a way to do it so when you say a mechanical object is responsible for a persons logical or illogical actions is ridiculous. GM or Ford can not take responsibility for some idiot running through a shopping mall full of christmas shoppers. Rach I am not angry except that people are not held responsibile for there actions. And Hitler was crazy do you think if he was told h couldnt kill the opposition that would have stopped him? Please dont tell me McVeigh wasnt mentally unstable. He was OBSESSED that in itself is is a mental problem when that is all he thinks about. What he did wasnt psychotic? Please tell me how many Sane ppl you know would do that. And btw i realize that snity is not a medical term its a legal term. lets stop arguing apples and oranges.





You know, this is very interesting. Almost all of these Left/Right, Liberal/Conservative, Democrat/Republican arguments seem to come down to different attitudes toward what is or isn't Responsible, and who or what is or isn't to Blame.

It's the same argument we had about the economy and Democratic versus Republican policy before the election, and I suspect it's the same argument whether we were to talk about abortion, or rape, or even religion. It's like there are two groups of people with opposing ideas about responsibility - each side feels that THEY're responsible, and that the other side ISN'T.

I'm not blaming a mechanical object, be it gun or automobile for the destruction those who wield them cause.
Does anybody here think Guns are to blame?

But do you think those who have a different point of view than your own are Irresponsible?

I do.



Guest
Posted: Sunday, December 16, 2012 5:21:07 PM

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Last year, in Florida, someone broke into my cousin's house and aimed a gun at him and his kids, telling them that if they cooperated, maybe he would let them live. My cousin's wife used their gun to shoot the intruder and they watched him till the cops arrived. If they didn't have that gun, my family might be missing 4 people today.

I'm not saying that every situation is the same and that everyone should have access to a gun, but to simply say 'take all the guns away' isn't really rational. There will always be the black market and people who really want guns will find a way to get them. I do think that stricter gun control should be in place though, no civillion has a need to carry a semi-automatic.
ByronLord
Posted: Sunday, December 16, 2012 5:56:27 PM

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one_winged_angel wrote:
Last year, in Florida, someone broke into my cousin's house and aimed a gun at him and his kids, telling them that if they cooperated, maybe he would let them live. My cousin's wife used their gun to shoot the intruder and they watched him till the cops arrived. If they didn't have that gun, my family might be missing 4 people today.

I'm not saying that every situation is the same and that everyone should have access to a gun, but to simply say 'take all the guns away' isn't really rational. There will always be the black market and people who really want guns will find a way to get them. I do think that stricter gun control should be in place though, no civillion has a need to carry a semi-automatic.


As with any complex situation there are a range of possible outcomes. The question is not whether a gun did or did not help in one particular case but whether having a gun is more likely to protect you or get you killed.

Even in the US the odds are very strongly that having a gun means you are more likely to be killed with a gun than if you do not. Comparing like with like, that is weighting the statistics for race, living environment, etc. you are 4.5 times more likely to be killed with a gun if you own one than if you do not.

Furthermore if you own a gun, any gun, by far the most likely person to be shot with it is yourself and if you do use it to kill it is most likely going to be a member of your family, not an intruder.

ByronLord
Posted: Sunday, December 16, 2012 6:03:38 PM

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Oberon wrote:

You know, this is very interesting. Almost all of these Left/Right, Liberal/Conservative, Democrat/Republican arguments seem to come down to different attitudes toward what is or isn't Responsible, and who or what is or isn't to Blame.

..
I'm not blaming a mechanical object, be it gun or automobile for the destruction those who wield them cause.
Does anybody here think Guns are to blame?


I don't think it is a question of who is responsible, it is a question of what the expected outcome is from a particular cause of action.

On the economy the fact is that we have tried the GOP 'trickle down' strategy three times now and every time the result was that the huge tax cuts for the wealthy produced only a huge deficit. The promised growth did not come. Now you can frame that as 'GOP responsible for deficits' if you like but the real point being made is that the predicted outcome of that policy is the observed outcome of that policy. Thus we should not try the policy again.

In the case of guns the problem is not the guns, it is not the people either. It is the people with the guns that cause the problem. Since we can't get rid of the people the only way to get rid of the people with guns is to get rid of the guns.

Guest
Posted: Sunday, December 16, 2012 6:08:14 PM

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ByronLord wrote:


As with any complex situation there are a range of possible outcomes. The question is not whether a gun did or did not help in one particular case but whether having a gun is more likely to protect you or get you killed.

Even in the US the odds are very strongly that having a gun means you are more likely to be killed with a gun than if you do not. Comparing like with like, that is weighting the statistics for race, living environment, etc. you are 4.5 times more likely to be killed with a gun if you own one than if you do not.

Furthermore if you own a gun, any gun, by far the most likely person to be shot with it is yourself and if you do use it to kill it is most likely going to be a member of your family, not an intruder.


While that may be true, for some people, owning a gun and being able to defend themselves is part of the reason why they and their families are alive today. My cousin and his family moved out of the area they'd been living in early this year and in June, my cousin's wife had a baby. One who probably wouldn't have been born if she hadn't shot the man who broke into their home. And yes, they still have the gun, tucked away safely in a place that only the adults in the house have access to.

Every single case is different and I'm just trying to point out that guns can be helpful depending on the situation they're used in.
Guest
Posted: Sunday, December 16, 2012 6:09:42 PM

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Ok this is the reason and no if you disagree that is your opinion and i respect that. No one takes responsibility for what they do anymore expectations and what we settle for are so low what do you expect. You get what you pay for. dont blame a machine its the person behind it. Hey you know computers dont mistakes either they read instructions. That is not directed to anyone before anyone takes offense its the truth.
Guest
Posted: Sunday, December 16, 2012 6:38:56 PM

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ByronLord wrote:


I don't think it is a question of who is responsible, it is a question of what the expected outcome is from a particular cause of action.

On the economy the fact is that we have tried the GOP 'trickle down' strategy three times now and every time the result was that the huge tax cuts for the wealthy produced only a huge deficit. The promised growth did not come. Now you can frame that as 'GOP responsible for deficits' if you like but the real point being made is that the predicted outcome of that policy is the observed outcome of that policy. Thus we should not try the policy again. - Of course not, yet Romney/Ryan wanted to institute it again, thinking Democratic policy was irresponsible.

In the case of guns the problem is not the guns, it is not the people either. It is the people with the guns that cause the problem. Since we can't get rid of the people the only way to get rid of the people with guns is to get rid of the guns.
Of course, yet gun-owners think they're responsible people, and this whole thread is about attaching BLAME to something other than gun-owners. ALL these arguments are about blame. See Angie 57's post above - it's about responsibility.
As if anyone is blaming machines.
ByronLord
Posted: Sunday, December 16, 2012 7:02:45 PM

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Oberon wrote:
Of course, yet gun-owners think they're responsible people, and this whole thread is about attaching BLAME to something other than gun-owners. ALL these arguments are about blame. See Angie 57's post above - it's about responsibility.
As if anyone is blaming machines.


I think it is all about trying to block out the facts that they know might threaten their world view.

What the gun control supporters have discovered this time round is that there is no penalty for going in hard and demanding gun control before the bodies are buried. Last time round they allowed themselves to be flim-flamed by the media parotting NRA talking points about it not being the time.

Which is why I was round the liberal blogs pushing everyone for an absolute ban as soon as I heard about the attack.

If we don't use every NRA sponsored mass murder as an opportunity to push for gun control we are going to see another one. It is not just the guns that the NRA promotes, it is the gun-nut culture they promote in which the lone warrior armed with a machine gun mows down the bad guys without remorse. The military styled weapons are not for hunting animals, they are for hunting people.

Guest
Posted: Sunday, December 16, 2012 7:10:29 PM

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ByronLord wrote:


I think it is all about trying to block out the facts that they know might threaten their world view. Absolutely, it's denial, and turning the conversation to mental health, or that the weapons were 'legally obtained, is obfuscation, (which is, ultimately, another way of denying).

What the gun control supporters have discovered this time round is that there is no penalty for going in hard and demanding gun control before the bodies are buried. Last time round they allowed themselves to be flim-flamed by the media parotting NRA talking points about it not being the time. The time is right because Obama won with a landslide, yet he needs to be goaded into doing the responsible thing and standing by his campaign promises.

Which is why I was round the liberal blogs pushing everyone for an absolute ban as soon as I heard about the attack.

If we don't use every NRA sponsored mass murder as an opportunity to push for gun control we are going to see another one. It is not just the guns that the NRA promotes, it is the gun-nut culture they promote in which the lone warrior armed with a machine gun mows down the bad guys without remorse. The military styled weapons are not for hunting animals, they are for hunting people.
tender_cowboy
Posted: Sunday, December 16, 2012 7:11:56 PM

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MR ByronLord I do not believe the NRA has ever or will ever sponsor a mass murder if you think they have would you please show some facts!
ByronLord
Posted: Sunday, December 16, 2012 7:15:20 PM

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beeper726 wrote:

True but let's remember the guns this guy had we're stolen, they weren't even his. Let me just say I do feel for the victims and their families, this is a tragedy but if there was one person there who legally possessed a gun a lot of people may have been saved.


There was a person with a legally owned weapon there. The shooter's gun nut mother who was the first victim.

That is not unusual by a long way. You are far more likely to be shot with your own gun than to use it for self defense.

There hasn't been a case in which a civilian has ended a shooting spree by shooting the shooter in the past 15 years. There have been a few when there was a civilian who tried. One ended up wounded, the other ended up dead.

tender_cowboy
Posted: Sunday, December 16, 2012 7:23:00 PM

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You are Wrong again MR ByronLord ..... read the following report from aug 12 2012 from Texas .....
tender_cowboy
Posted: Sunday, December 16, 2012 7:24:26 PM

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foxjack
Posted: Sunday, December 16, 2012 7:33:21 PM

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And on the same day in china 23 injured at school in a knife attack:


If anything this incident makes me think the instructors at schools should carry weapons and have proper training to use them. This whole thing would have been prevented.
sprite
Posted: Sunday, December 16, 2012 7:40:51 PM

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foxjack wrote:
And on the same day in china 23 injured at school in a knife attack:


If anything this incident makes me think the instructors at schools should carry weapons and have proper training to use them. This whole thing would have been prevented.


as much as this is a tragedy as well, look very carefully at the word i bolded out. Injured. Not killed, not murdered. injured. those kid are going to go home to their parents. perhaps they will have scars, both physical and emotional, but they will heal over time. they live. Had he had a gun, the story would have been different. doesn't anyone else get it?

http://www.lushstories.com/stories/hardcore/west-coast-games-part-one-the-beach.aspx
Daddyskitten
Posted: Sunday, December 16, 2012 7:44:01 PM

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Has anyone noticed that all these shootings occur where guns ARE NOT ALLOWED? schools, shopping malls, theaters. All places where legal, sane gun owners are not allowed to take their weapons. When someone decides to do this, they know no one going to stop them. Instead of taking guns away they should allow them everywhere. Will it stop the crazy/criminal people from trying? no. Will it limit the causalities? I really think it will.

I have no problem with making gun laws stricter as far as being able to get them. I think everyone should be trained (extensively) in how to use them and have to pass a mental health check yearly. Taking them away will accomplish nothing as the "war on drugs" has proven. If someone wants something, and are willing to pay for it, then they will find a way to get them. I would really rather have something to protect myself with than have to wait on police who are understaffed, overworked and quite a distance away. This is america, pizza can get to your house faster than the police.

To me the real question is not about the guns, but how our society allows people to get to this point. I believe this is several problems rolled into one. I believe part of this is the media glorifying what they did and splashing the shooter all over the news. They are celebrities, everyone knows their name. They were nobodies in life but in death, they are famous and known across the world. The media needs to stop this. The focus should be about the victims not the killer.

We know all the shooters in things like this are friendless and alone. We know this yet, we as a society do nothing when we see the odd kid walking down the hall getting bullied. No one bothers to eat lunch with the guy who always sits alone. We do nothing to connect with them as human beings. No one cares about them, why should they care about anyone else. We as a society can not continue to ignore others and still expect them to be care about what happens to you later. It doesn't work that way.

We know they come from broken homes, either divorce or some time of abuse is going on or both. People who are close to the families say they knew they were struggling but they didn't want to interfere, didn't want to get involved, so they sat on their hands and did nothing. these people have no support network, they feel alone and are rightly, angry with how their life is going. They have no one to vent to, no one to hold them when they cry, to understand their pain.

So i ask you, when was the last time you stepped out of your comfort zone and stood up for someone? Did the right thing and told the bully to shut up? Told HR that your boss was unfairly coming down on so and so? Decide to take the time to get to know the loner, the goth, the weird person at work? Ate lunch with a stranger because they looked lonely? Its not that hard to makes these stop, we just need to care about everyone so they in turn will care about us.

i had one friend, who years later confided that when i made friends with them, i not only saved them, i probably saved a lot of people in the school as well. Did i stop my school from being the next columbine just because i decided that while i was in school, no one would be alone like i had been in the past? I don't know. All i know for sure is that i had over 30 friends in school. All the people who no one wanted to hang out with. The geeks, nerds, weirdo's, gay's, lesbians, bisexual, anyone that the majority of the school rejected we took in. They were lonely, angry, struggling with life at home, some were suicidal or just plain weird. We gave them a network of people to come to, to vent and laugh and socialize. I didn't know how important what i did was, until years later when my friends all had families of their own, jobs and homes of their own.

When i hear about these shooting and suicides on the news. People raising hell about guns and security, it makes me angry that they want to try and slap a big band aid over it by changing laws or taking things away instead of getting to root of the problem. There is no law that will fix the problem. If they take away guns, these people will still be angry, lonely and will just use knives or bombs or poison. stopping events like this will take the american people deciding to give a damn about each other. To stop accepting divorce as a easy solution, to make marriage important again, to make family important again, to know our neighbors, to be tolerant of one another and to be kind to others.

There is a saying that it takes a village to raise a child. Its true, and it will always be true. Whether that child is 2 or 50 its still true. We need people to be happy. This issue isn't about guns, or video games or violence on TV, its a human issue about people being ignored, abused and neglected by their fellow human beings.

ByronLord
Posted: Sunday, December 16, 2012 8:49:17 PM

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jillinjulie wrote:
An odd perspective, but I have a concealed carry permit as part of my job as a jeweler who transports valuable merchandise.
Trained extensively; but hope never ever to have a confrontation.
Lest I do, I have a first line of defense to protect my life and maybe others.
Not everyone is in the same situation as I so I do not expect support.


The instructions of every bank teller in the country are that if someone says they have a gun, they hand over the cash in the safe and the dye pack. If they do not they will be fired.

The US banks loose a few tens of millions a year in that type of bank robbery, they very rarely lose a teller or see a customer shot.

There are plenty of security companies that can deliver valuables from point A to point B without risk. You should tell your employer to use one.

keoloke
Posted: Sunday, December 16, 2012 8:50:23 PM

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principessa wrote:
Some of the comments here remind me of a line from an old comic strip: "We have seen the enemy and he is us."

The US has more than 300 million non-military weapons - almost one per every person, adult and child, in the country. Why? What civilized country lives that way? Americans can sometimes be obnoxious in their exceptionalism, the idea that they are somehow better than the rest of us in the world. This time you are an exception in the circle of civilized countries - and not in a good way.

Those who worship at the shrine of the NRA would have teachers armed. Maybe they would have the students armed too. Training could start in kindergarten. Children could learn to shoot before they learn to read. By high school they could shoot AK-47s or God knows what weapon. Perhaps that could be necessary for high school graduation.

Look at the world you have created. Think about it. The definition of madness is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result. You are right. People kill people. But they kill people with guns. This has to change. I am naively hopeful that this time, finally, the NRA will lose its grip on your Senators and Congressmen and that sensible regulation will follow.


Well done Principessa.

Too bad, many people would still side with the increase of legal guns in the streets to “combat” this. Fact is, shooting of these proportion in the US have been executed with legal vs. illegal guns five to one, and they still want to put more legal gun in circulation.

So, with every one having legal guns, one day (after so many shootings.. like the ass that took a parking spot) we would be required when we enter the city limits to hand our weapons to the nearsr police precinct, but just for the time being in the area.
Like I have said in another thread is “the Oregon Trail” allover again.

Sadly, most of the shooting of this magnitude (US) have occurred in the last FIVE years. A deep rooted problem that many people think of fixing with more guns. Also time ago a study concluded: most guns = most homicide.

THE STUDY I hope they don't spend too much money on these researches. Pull trigger, bullet will come out.

But Hey, if most peoples think that it will fix the problem, this is good news for the gun industry.. hum this could open another market, with special smaller guns, easier to load and use.. just for children. Ching Ching!

Oooh your gun ain't better than mine, oooh your gun ain't better than mine. New kindergarten song!
I'm crying serioulsy.

Choose n Practice Happiness

Life is simple; we are what we eat and what we read. Talk is superfluous.
Buz
Posted: Sunday, December 16, 2012 8:56:37 PM

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The guy in Connecticut used an assault rifle with NATO ammunition for the most part of his nightmare attack.

I am an avid hunter and I don't use assault rifles or NATO ammunition to hunt. There really is no need for people to be carrying around military weaponry. In all these mass killings military weaponry is the main tool of attack. Something has to be done about keeping military weapons out of the hands of psychos. Those type weapons are also the guns of choice of organized criminals such as gangs and crime syndicates. Of course most of those are smuggled, bought and sold illegally.

I have no problem with more serious gun laws and longer waiting periods for someone to make a gun purchase. Criminal and mental background checks should be made of anyone purchasing a gun. Also, military assault weapons and ammunition need to be curbed or eradicated.

Certainly there are other social & cultural issues to be considered here. Those would include violent video games and movies and such. I myself have played many violent video games and I enjoy violent movies such as those by Quentin Tarantino movies quite a bit, but how much are those games and movies desensitizing people to murder, violence and death? The majority of people can handle such entertainment but evidently not so for many people with mental illnesses.

I just heard on the news that up to 20% of the population could be suffering some form of mental illness. I am sure most of those are not dangerous but what percentage is?

Unfortunately some warped minds may see personal glory and fame in carrying out such sick mass killings. That is very disturbing.

When I heard of those children being killed in Connecticut I had to get alone cry.

Guest
Posted: Sunday, December 16, 2012 10:06:49 PM

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BTW Byron there is such a thing as drug induced psychosis. So if mr mcveigh was strung out on speed it could have something to do with his decision making and judgement
terry20069
Posted: Sunday, December 16, 2012 10:36:25 PM

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TURN OFF THE NEWS.......

Morgan Freeman's brilliant take on what happened yesterday :

"You want to know why. This may sound cynical, but here's why.

...It's because of the way the media reports it. Flip on the news and watch how we treat the Batman theater shooter and the Oregon mall shooter like celebrities. Dylan Klebold and Eric Harris are household names, but do you know the name of a single *victim* of Columbine? Disturbed
people who would otherwise just off themselves in their basements see the news and want to top it by doing something worse, and going out in a memorable way. Why a grade school? Why children? Because he'll be remembered as a horrible monster, instead of a sad nobody.

CNN's article says that if the body count "holds up", this will rank as the second deadliest shooting behind Virginia Tech, as if statistics somehow make one shooting worse than another. Then they post a video interview of third-graders for all the details of what they saw and heard while the shootings were happening. Fox News has plastered the killer's face on all their reports for hours. Any articles or news stories yet that focus on the victims and ignore the killer's identity? None that I've seen yet. Because they don't sell. So congratulations, sensationalist media, you've just lit the fire for someone to top this and knock off a day care center or a maternity ward next.

You can help by forgetting you ever read this man's name, and remembering the name of at least one victim. You can help by donating to mental health research instead of pointing to gun control as the problem. You can help by turning off the news."

NUMQUAM FIDES CATELLUS!!!
Frank_Lee
Posted: Sunday, December 16, 2012 11:06:50 PM

Rank: Forum Guru

Joined: 1/30/2010
Posts: 234
Buz wrote:
The guy in Connecticut used an assault rifle with NATO ammunition for the most part of his nightmare attack.

I am an avid hunter and I don't use assault rifles or NATO ammunition to hunt. There really is no need for people to be carrying around military weaponry. In all these mass killings military weaponry is the main tool of attack. Something has to be done about keeping military weapons out of the hands of psychos. Those type weapons are also the guns of choice of organized criminals such as gangs and crime syndicates. Of course most of those are smuggled, bought and sold illegally.

I have no problem with more serious gun laws and longer waiting periods for someone to make a gun purchase. Criminal and mental background checks should be made of anyone purchasing a gun. Also, military assault weapons and ammunition need to be curbed or eradicated.

Certainly there are other social & cultural issues to be considered here. Those would include violent video games and movies and such. I myself have played many violent video games and I enjoy violent movies such as those by Quentin Tarantino movies quite a bit, but how much are those games and movies desensitizing people to murder, violence and death? The majority of people can handle such entertainment but evidently not so for many people with mental illnesses.

I just heard on the news that up to 20% of the population could be suffering some form of mental illness. I am sure most of those are not dangerous but what percentage is?

Unfortunately some warped minds may see personal glory and fame in carrying out such sick mass killings. That is very disturbing.

When I heard of those children being killed in Connecticut I had to get alone cry.


Buz, I really think the NRA would be in a much better position if they had you for a spokesman. Responsible, rational gun owners aren't the problem, yet we have too many gun related problems in this country. And one thing that usually happens in America, when something like this happens, people say we need different laws when we've failed to enforce the laws we already have. More laws are just to make people feel better for a little while. It's like a social placebo.

There's been a lot of heated discussion about guns in these forums lately. Times like this, it just seems politics and ideology stack up like a pile of bovine manure, and maybe we'd all be better off if more of us take that moment like Buz did to remember to stop and weep for those children in CT. And yeah...turning off the fucking news wouldn't be such a bad idea, either.

http://mamabythebay.com/2012/12/14/to-the-media-regarding-newtown/





tazznjazz
Posted: Monday, December 17, 2012 6:03:08 AM

Rank: Forum Guru

Joined: 4/30/2012
Posts: 329
Location: under bright lights, United States
SWEDEN – After a full decade of research, a team of Swedish scientists has confirmed that no matter how many guns a man owns, his penis will remain small and insignificant.

“Ve look at ze mens wit ze guns and ve look at ze penis of zeese mens,” said Dr. Sven Svenenberg of the Svenlandia Institute. “Itz veery zad. Ze penis is so wee.”

The research looked at 300 average American men who owned multiple guns. Those 300 were then weighed, measure, and found wanting. Following that, the men were then encouraged to buy even more guns over the next year. They were then were then weighed and measured again, and found wanting even more.

“Ze penis iz so wee, still,” said Dr. Svenenberg in an accent that no one could really identify. “Iz almozt of no uze. Like a wee pinkie toe.”

American scientist Tim Johnson said the research proved what has long been suspected – that owning guns for hunting and self-protection is generally a lie and that most men buy guns because they feel it will be an extension of their manhood.

“We’ve known this all along. We call it the ‘Glenn Beck Effect,’” said Johnson from his home office in Tupelo, Miss. “Not long ago, a Wikileaks document emerged showing a naked picture of Beck. Dude’s hung like a pimple on a pimple. Then all of a sudden you start seeing the guy show up holding guns.”

Still, some have called the research misleading. Ron Schmeits, President of the NRA said that the problem was that the men in the research sample were not encouraged to buy enough guns.

“These small men will get larger if they own more guns,” said Schmeits, handing out checks to Republican congressmen on the steps of the nation’s capital. “They need pistols and shotguns and guns that have guns attached to them and guns that shoot guns. That will fix them right up.”

But Dr. Svenenberg stood by his research.

“Zey are so wee, it’z almozt to make me to laugh,” said Dr. Svenenberg. “But no. I don’t to laugh. Iz zad. Zo veery zad.”

–WKW
foxjack
Posted: Monday, December 17, 2012 6:20:04 AM

Rank: Forum Guru

Joined: 4/25/2010
Posts: 712
Location: Pierre, United States
Someone should do a research topic on how much you have to think about penis all day before you start to believe that penis is the reason why people do anything...
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