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cheeseball
Posted: Sunday, March 31, 2013 9:40:44 PM

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Location: Chicago, United States
I think Kim Jong Un is just plain bat-shit crazy. Nutbag
Jack_42
Posted: Monday, April 01, 2013 4:24:51 AM

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Joined: 8/21/2009
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Location: Prague, Czech Republic
Kitanica wrote:


The reason the Cuban missile crisis ended the way it did was because kennedy made a secret under the table deal the administration never admitted to publicly or they'd look weak. It was a peaceful de-escalation where everyone got what they wanted. It showed the new leaders were willing to play ball, where as Stalin never would have. The ussr would withdraw from Cuba, Kennedy gets to takes credit and say Russia blinked in the stare-down then about 6months later all hush hush we would take our missiles out of turkey. No one has to get lit up atomic style. America and the Ussr could hold their own. we bluffed, they bluffed, we spent on quality, they went quantity. Hence why it's called the cold war. When you setup missile launch sites a hour away from targets things get real regardless.

North Koreas a different situation from the ussr, it's not a multinational league. It's one totalitarian regime, and it's not weakening. They eat fine, the populace suffer. The ussr coup was government vs government. North Korea won't change unless it's the citizens rising up against a million man army which will end in the country destroying itself and being absorbed by south korea; external intervention resulting in the same outcome, or northkorea being dumb enough to poke the world lion with a big fat stick and get malled.

North Korea couldn't fight itself out of a wet torn paperbag against any fully developed nation of the west or east. They boast a big army on land. But that gets you no where when you can't move them, feed them abroad, or support them by sea and air. North koreas completely isolated. An army can't do anything locked in a tiny peninsula. They're ships aren't going anywhere, their planes aren't either. They can't get their missiles straight. They may pose a threat to South Korea or the citizens of North Korea but to NATO it's laughable. So I don't see where your getting this idea that the ussr and north Korea are just yanking our chain. The ussr could have bombed us off the face of the earth and vice versa. North Korea doesn't even have a stable delivery platform or a payload to send. The Entire cold war was a fallacy because no ones dumb enough to launch a nuke and go down that road, it was mostly just the war industry profiteering, but it doesn't change the fact that the threat was real. it doesn't matter if no one pushed the button. It only took a crossed wire or false alert on a radar screen or someone tripping and pushing it by accident (that's not how they're actually launched but that's not the point) Your age is irrelevant because you seem to have a rudimentary understanding of the Cold War-Cuban missile crisis as you wouldn't be comparing it to the completely empty threats of Pyongyang. dontknow

Kim Jong Un can talk all he wants but he can't back it up like the soviets could have. I don't know any other countries that try to threaten the strongest military presence in the world while seemingly ignoring the fact they run entirely off foreign aid and can't feed their own people.
We beat North Korea once, were prepared to do it again if we have to. The Korean War wasn't a stalemate because North Korea is some kind of savant military power. They got their asses handed to them and they called their big buddy china to come help just like we stepped in to help South Korea when they got there beating. (pardon the language there) The north doesn't have that option anymore like the south does. They're out of luck.

You can't just lump them together, it was a turning point, It's more likely to end future conflicts than "the war to end all wars" because it was the first time man learned to stop and think before acting and realize this whole business is unacceptable in a civilized society. Kims just a douche.



From what I can gather from all these strategic details you are giving you seem to be proving my point that the cold war was all a con or to use your word bluff and furthermore that there is no reason to worry about North Korea which again I've already said. Looking at my comments I'm not quite sure why you are saying all this, unless you're concerned about the population of North Korea in particular. And I will lump flag waving bully boys together if I want including ''the strongest military presence in the world'' which is not something to be proud of in my opinion. I perfectly understood the rudimentary facts of the cold war and knew they were never going to do it unless of course as you mention it was by accident although I felt my earlier reference to Dr Strangelove said that or didn't you get the joke? My age is relevant in terms of I've seen it all before and could do without all this childish warfare which would just be tiresome if the implications weren't so serious. And young men talking about ''asses kicked'' like it was all some sort of football (sorry soccer) game is equally disheartening.
Kitanica
Posted: Monday, April 01, 2013 7:11:27 AM

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Joined: 4/16/2011
Posts: 881
Location: The Sprawl, United States
Amusing.
If anyone has a more succinct way of describing north Koreas 4 month of total ground loss all the way to the Chinese border i'd be open to editing it and putting in. I like the asses kicked part otherwise. Evidently 2013 is a new cold war since they're both just cons. North Korea is just as dangerous as the ussr. My mistake lol. I'll go on eBay now and find a copy of duck and cover and start brushing up on my Korean. f-hihi

11:56pm thanks North Korea.


Guest
Posted: Monday, April 01, 2013 10:42:05 PM

Rank: Lurker

Joined: 12/1/2006
Posts: 537,401
Ummm, okay, you recently wrote a paper on Korea and you have some "facts." Korea and Cold War, no comparison. If you care to actually illustrate the gravity between the North Korean regime/oligarchy/patriarch system to what occurred during the cuban missile crisis/khrushchev and the shoe incident, then do so. Some substantive back up would be appreciated. The menacing mental midget compared to three decades of political resculpting that occurred then, draws yawns.

Personally, I am more worried about the multiple issues of North Korea, Kashmir, and Pakistan. Concentrating on one issue usually leaves you caught off guard.

"Thus those skilled in war subdue the enemy's army without battle .... They conquer by strategy." -- Sun Tzu.

If current focus is as yours seems to be, then battle may be evident. But, I'm hopeful that others aren't as short-sighted.
DirtyMartini
Posted: Thursday, April 04, 2013 10:28:38 AM

Rank: Purveyor of Poetry & Porn

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Here's an update on this whole Korea situation btw...




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Liz
Posted: Friday, April 05, 2013 5:44:30 AM

Rank: Scarlet Seductress

Joined: 1/22/2013
Posts: 4,665
Location: In the sweet shop, United Kingdom
I think someone needs to explain to Supreme Leader Kim Jong-un (or whatever bullshit title he's using at the moment), that April Fools is not for the entire month of April!
Nutbag




Guest
Posted: Friday, April 05, 2013 4:05:26 PM

Rank: Lurker

Joined: 12/1/2006
Posts: 537,401
Meh, give the kid a break, what would you do if stuck in the ridiculous position of having to be a deity?
Kitanica
Posted: Friday, April 05, 2013 8:18:26 PM

Rank: Forum Guru

Joined: 4/16/2011
Posts: 881
Location: The Sprawl, United States
Liz wrote:
I think someone needs to explain to Supreme Leader Kim Jong-un (or whatever bullshit title he's using at the moment), that April Fools is not for the entire month of April!
Nutbag



my favorite post on this thread lol
Z1992
Posted: Saturday, April 06, 2013 9:47:20 PM

Rank: Active Ink Slinger

Joined: 1/29/2013
Posts: 44
Location: United States
The fact that North Korea believes they can do any damage to the United States is actually quite humorous. North Korea is just a pathetic "complainer" nation that likes to "stir the pot."

North Korea currently has over 1 million men/women in active duty, and another 8 million in reserve. Sure, they may have the worlds largest standing army, China as an ally, and nuclear weapons. But the North Koreans have a terrible Navy. The only positive side to their Navy is their submarines. They do not have aircraft carriers, which are needed for an land invasion. The North Koreans think they can get away with anything because China has their back. Although recently, China has been backing away from North Korea.

In my opinion of what would happen if the United States and its Asian allies were to go to war with North Korea: the North Korean military would be met with the combined force of American, South Korean and Japanese forces (possibly Australian and Canadian too, though highly doubtful). The North Koreans would immediately be backed-up by Belarus and Iran, though it would be unlikely that those countries would also declare war on the United States and its allies, they would only send aid to the North Koreans. Same goes for China. China would not get involved in the war (right away), they would only send aid to their ally. Russia probably would too, but again, doubtful (and this whole thing with Russia backing-up enemies of the United States needs to stop. The Russian military is a pathetic shadow of its former Soviet self). Sooner or later, after the North Koreans begin losing the war, China would eventually have to support their ally militarily. This would cause the Shanghai Cooperation Organization (SCO) and the Collective Security Treaty Organization (CSTO) to create a combined military coalition against the United States (though this would cripple the US and Chinese economy - thus the world economy). This action would effectively cause the North Atlantic Treaty Organization (NATO) to declare war on that military coalition. This would ultimately lead to World War III and the destruction of the human race.

^Again, the above is my own opinion of what would happen, a statement given with my knowledge gained from facts and hours of research. I know what is written above may seem extreme, but it is my own general assumption - I could be completely wrong.

But back to the main topic; North Korea just needs to shut the fuck up and mind their own business. They are a pathetic waste of time and resources for the United States.
Guest
Posted: Sunday, April 07, 2013 2:29:32 AM

Rank: Lurker

Joined: 12/1/2006
Posts: 537,401
Z1992 wrote:
The fact that North Korea believes they can do any damage to the United States is actually quite humorous. North Korea is just a pathetic "complainer" nation that likes to "stir the pot."

North Korea currently has over 1 million men/women in active duty, and another 8 million in reserve. Sure, they may have the worlds largest standing army, China as an ally, and nuclear weapons. But the North Koreans have a terrible Navy. The only positive side to their Navy is their submarines. They do not have aircraft carriers, which are needed for an land invasion. The North Koreans think they can get away with anything because China has their back. Although recently, China has been backing away from North Korea.

In my opinion of what would happen if the United States and its Asian allies were to go to war with North Korea: the North Korean military would be met with the combined force of American, South Korean and Japanese forces (possibly Australian and Canadian too, though highly doubtful). The North Koreans would immediately be backed-up by Belarus and Iran, though it would be unlikely that those countries would also declare war on the United States and its allies, they would only send aid to the North Koreans. Same goes for China. China would not get involved in the war (right away), they would only send aid to their ally. Russia probably would too, but again, doubtful (and this whole thing with Russia backing-up enemies of the United States needs to stop. The Russian military is a pathetic shadow of its former Soviet self). Sooner or later, after the North Koreans begin losing the war, China would eventually have to support their ally militarily. This would cause the Shanghai Cooperation Organization (SCO) and the Collective Security Treaty Organization (CSTO) to create a combined military coalition against the United States (though this would cripple the US and Chinese economy - thus the world economy). This action would effectively cause the North Atlantic Treaty Organization (NATO) to declare war on that military coalition. This would ultimately lead to World War III and the destruction of the human race.

^Again, the above is my own opinion of what would happen, a statement given with my knowledge gained from facts and hours of research. I know what is written above may seem extreme, but it is my own general assumption - I could be completely wrong.

But back to the main topic; North Korea just needs to shut the fuck up and mind their own business. They are a pathetic waste of time and resources for the United States.


Your points appear to be well-taken.

One of my students is studying North Korea for an independent research project. He's found that it's the last real refuge for hard-core Stalinists who can't bring themselves to believe that Uncle Joe devastated his vast country more thoroughly than anyone except his rival Hitler. Really, if Hitler had not been SO dead set on crushing Russia and had made an alliance with the USSR that had endured, World War II would have been a LOT messier and more drawn out than it actually was, which is really saying something.

North Korean is Stalinist USSR in miniature. They have their own gulag, they have their army, they have an Asiatic despot who thinks he can conquer the world -- just let him at 'em! (Bleep) any capitalistic reforms. (Bleep) any trade with the enemy. Kim Jong Un chooses to forget that China is only a half-hearted ally (as his father forgot, but at least he didn't attack without Chinese permission), and forgets that Stalin's Soviet Union stayed out of the Korean War for whatever reason, probably because it was too busy in Europe. Now, Vladimir Putin's Russia is interested only in itself. China is also busy with its own infrastructure and with building a trade empire all over the world. Neither nation would fight on North Korea's side except in the most desperate of circumstances.

I lived through much of the Vietnam War and believed throughout that America was fighting to keep the countries involved from Holocaust 2.0, which definitely happened in Cambodia. Those Stalinists and Maoists can be VICIOUS motherfuckers when they run rampant. I still believe in fighting the Taliban and al-Qaeda and their Islamist offshoots tooth and nail for the same reason. But I'd just give Kim Jong Un the equivalent of an extended middle finger and watch for any surprise attacks and kick their asses back where they came, and then pull back and watch to see if they have much war enthusiasm after they get busted a few times. If they want Holocaust 3.0 they are gonna be in for a BIG surprise. Only total fanatics believe war is easy and they all learn their lesson sooner or later.

I just hope we don't get too many of the peace-at-any-price group of people who cannot abide war in any form. Individually they are to be respected, even applauded. But they need to see the facts of what the war fanatics can do if not stopped.
Z1992
Posted: Sunday, April 07, 2013 12:04:20 PM

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Joined: 1/29/2013
Posts: 44
Location: United States
midnightraider61 wrote:


Your points appear to be well-taken.

One of my students is studying North Korea for an independent research project. He's found that it's the last real refuge for hard-core Stalinists who can't bring themselves to believe that Uncle Joe devastated his vast country more thoroughly than anyone except his rival Hitler. Really, if Hitler had not been SO dead set on crushing Russia and had made an alliance with the USSR that had endured, World War II would have been a LOT messier and more drawn out than it actually was, which is really saying something.

North Korean is Stalinist USSR in miniature. They have their own gulag, they have their army, they have an Asiatic despot who thinks he can conquer the world -- just let him at 'em! (Bleep) any capitalistic reforms. (Bleep) any trade with the enemy. Kim Jong Un chooses to forget that China is only a half-hearted ally (as his father forgot, but at least he didn't attack without Chinese permission), and forgets that Stalin's Soviet Union stayed out of the Korean War for whatever reason, probably because it was too busy in Europe. Now, Vladimir Putin's Russia is interested only in itself. China is also busy with its own infrastructure and with building a trade empire all over the world. Neither nation would fight on North Korea's side except in the most desperate of circumstances.

I lived through much of the Vietnam War and believed throughout that America was fighting to keep the countries involved from Holocaust 2.0, which definitely happened in Cambodia. Those Stalinists and Maoists can be VICIOUS motherfuckers when they run rampant. I still believe in fighting the Taliban and al-Qaeda and their Islamist offshoots tooth and nail for the same reason. But I'd just give Kim Jong Un the equivalent of an extended middle finger and watch for any surprise attacks and kick their asses back where they came, and then pull back and watch to see if they have much war enthusiasm after they get busted a few times. If they want Holocaust 3.0 they are gonna be in for a BIG surprise. Only total fanatics believe war is easy and they all learn their lesson sooner or later.

I just hope we don't get too many of the peace-at-any-price group of people who cannot abide war in any form. Individually they are to be respected, even applauded. But they need to see the facts of what the war fanatics can do if not stopped.


Before World War II broke out in Europe, Stalin and Hitler had signed an accord that provided Hitler the resources he needed to rebuild the German military (completely against the Treaty of Versailles). Not only with the Soviet Union, but Nazi Germany had a military alliance with Italy that was signed in May of 1939, and later with Spain, Japan, Romania, Hungary and Bulgaria. Although Italy and Spain had conflicting differences between how they were to deal with Europe during wartime - which is why Spain only slightly got involved in World War II (Blue Division). When Nazi Germany invaded Poland in 1939, the Soviet Union also invaded. Germany took western Poland, the Soviets took the east. Though it is well known, even by Stalin, that Hitler hated Communism almost as much as he was anti-Semitic. In 1941, Hitler's dream of "room to live" for the German people finally went into action. Though Hitler's biggest mistake; not preparing for the Russian winter. (if he was smart, he would have looked to history, and realized the same thing happened to Napoleon in 1812) Anyway, we all know how World War II ends.

The Soviet Union did get involved in the Korean War. They sent medical and war materials to the North Koreans, and even the Soviet Air Force engaged the American Air Force in dog fights. But the Soviet Union never sent ground forces. The Chinese (who the US was at war with) felt betrayed, because the Chinese wanted Soviet ground forces to fight along side Chinese ground forces. This lead to the Sino-Soviet Split. Did you know that North Korea has concentration camps in Russia? I believe they're still in use.

Holocausts were non-stop in the 20th century. The Armenian genocide by the Turks, the Ukrainian genocide by the Soviets, the Chinese and Vietnamese genocide by the Japanese, Jewish genocide by the Nazi's and so on...

I agree with your final statement, but consider this: Sometimes when you have the biggest stick, you have to flaunt it to keep the peace. Evidence of this can be found in the Gulf War of 1991.
asleep
Posted: Sunday, April 07, 2013 4:07:09 PM

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Kitanica
Posted: Sunday, April 07, 2013 4:07:24 PM

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Joined: 4/16/2011
Posts: 881
Location: The Sprawl, United States
Z1992 wrote:


Before World War II broke out in Europe, Stalin and Hitler had signed an accord that provided Hitler the resources he needed to rebuild the German military (completely against the Treaty of Versailles). Not only with the Soviet Union, but Nazi Germany had a military alliance with Italy that was signed in May of 1939, and later with Spain, Japan, Romania, Hungary and Bulgaria. Although Italy and Spain had conflicting differences between how they were to deal with Europe during wartime - which is why Spain only slightly got involved in World War II (Blue Division). When Nazi Germany invaded Poland in 1939, the Soviet Union also invaded. Germany took western Poland, the Soviets took the east. Though it is well known, even by Stalin, that Hitler hated Communism almost as much as he was anti-Semitic. In 1941, Hitler's dream of "room to live" for the German people finally went into action. Though Hitler's biggest mistake; not preparing for the Russian winter. (if he was smart, he would have looked to history, and realized the same thing happened to Napoleon in 1812) Anyway, we all know how World War II ends.

The Soviet Union did get involved in the Korean War. They sent medical and war materials to the North Koreans, and even the Soviet Air Force engaged the American Air Force in dog fights. But the Soviet Union never sent ground forces. The Chinese (who the US was at war with) felt betrayed, because the Chinese wanted Soviet ground forces to fight along side Chinese ground forces. This lead to the Sino-Soviet Split. Did you know that North Korea has concentration camps in Russia? I believe they're still in use.

Holocausts were non-stop in the 20th century. The Armenian genocide by the Turks, the Ukrainian genocide by the Soviets, the Chinese and Vietnamese genocide by the Japanese, Jewish genocide by the Nazi's and so on...

I agree with your final statement, but consider this: Sometimes when you have the biggest stick, you have to flaunt it to keep the peace. Evidence of this can be found in the Gulf War of 1991.


He should have just shelved operation Barbarossa altogether. I don't think preparing better would have changed the outcome that much; he spent too many resources. Napoleon's one of the best strategists and yeah, like you said it didn't go so well for him.

Your right about the a lot messier bit midnight. If he had all 4million or so troops and panzers in Europe and Africa it would have been operation market garden all over for the allies.
He might have even suceeded with the battle of the bulge if he had more fuel left.
asleep
Posted: Sunday, April 07, 2013 4:11:26 PM

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Joined: 12/30/2011
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WellMadeMale
Posted: Wednesday, April 10, 2013 7:47:17 PM

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Joined: 9/30/2009
Posts: 10,299
Location: Cakeland, United States
Q. Why did the chicken cross the road?

A. To escape North Korea's long-range missiles.

If ya can't beat 'em... pay someone to do it for you.
LOVES4PLAY
Posted: Wednesday, April 10, 2013 9:11:54 PM

Rank: Forum Guru

Joined: 10/14/2010
Posts: 944
Location: JUST A CLICK AWAY, United States
Any one watch the movie "THE MOUSE THAT ROARED"?Its a satire about a small improvised country that declared war on the united States,Knowing that after their defeat the USA would dump millions into their debt stricken country..

Trouble is this bozo is playing in an elevator that does not go to the top floor & way to much power..and sadly a lot of people could get hurt
asleep
Posted: Wednesday, April 10, 2013 9:46:56 PM

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kylie_kained
Posted: Wednesday, April 10, 2013 10:35:00 PM

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Joined: 8/17/2010
Posts: 994
Location: Over your Knee Screaming and Kicking!, United King
Within day's maybe hours now we may well find out just how stupid he is.
















Z1992
Posted: Thursday, April 11, 2013 12:29:19 AM

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Joined: 1/29/2013
Posts: 44
Location: United States
WellMadeMale wrote:
Q. Why did the chicken cross the road?

A. To escape North Korea's long-range missiles.


False.

A. Because it was suicidal.

xD
hankyspanky
Posted: Thursday, April 11, 2013 6:25:30 AM

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Joined: 11/4/2012
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He needs some long hard sex! If he can manage to satisfy him&the lady!
Guest
Posted: Saturday, April 20, 2013 9:29:22 PM

Rank: Lurker

Joined: 12/1/2006
Posts: 537,401
WellMadeMale wrote:
Q. Why did the chicken cross the road?

A. To escape North Korea's long-range missiles.



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