Are you saying that you and dames are the only ones allowed to call people names and be insulting? Why is that? Did I hurt your iddle-widdle feelings? If so, then good. And I hope I hurt dame's iddle-widdle feelings also. You two like to be insulting and act like spoiled brats around here. That's no secret. Dames in particular acts like his parents never taught him any manners, or how to disagree with someone politely, without acting like a jackbag. I posted what I did, the way I did, to make a point. Several points, in fact.

First, I wanted you to know how I really feel. It doesn't take an overabundance of human compassion to not act like dames does. You just have to be polite. Acting like an asshole all the time doesn't add to this site in any way. In fact, it surely takes away from it. There's no way to know how many people would post in the Think Tank but don't because they don't want to have all that scorn and derision heaped on them, but I feel sure that more than one have been turned away once they read how he (and you) treat fellow Lushies.

Second, I wanted to remind you that people do have feelings, and the way you two act toward people hurts them. You can state an opposing viewpoint without being an asshole about it. You hide behind the sinecure of "This is Adult Swim, Baby" and "It's all honest debate - people know what they're getting into when they post here", but in reality, you're just being hurtful toward people for no reason other than you enjoy hurting others. And that's not only criminal, it's inhuman. People that enjoy hurting others for no reason are not 'people', they're psychopaths.

Third, you two seem to enjoy posting opinions that you may not actually hold, just to cause controversy. Or you post them in such a way as to be the instigator of controversy, of arguments. Is it any surprise when someone turns it around on you?

For the record, I hope that will be the last time I post something like that. I don't enjoy being rude, nor do I enjoy being insulting. Hurling insults is something you do when you've run out of arguments. Unfortunately, it's the first thing you and dames do, as a matter of course. It's like your attitude is "the first one to draw blood wins". It's counterproductive, adds nothing to the site, adds nothing to the ongoing debate, and only serves to deter other people from posting. I posted it to give you a small sample of how you treat others, and hope that maybe you'll see how others feel about it. I do want to apologize to Nic, if she's watching. I know I should have cleared that diatribe through her before I posted it, but I saw an opportunity and I took it. I've previously asked dames in private messages not to be so insulting and obsequious, and not only did he not change his ways, he became more insulting and hurtful in the way he treats others. His kind of behavior is something we don't need around here.

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I never should have clicked. Now I have a headache.

personally, I don't think a persons intelligence comes into said debate. what I am more concerned about is whether people believe what they believe for intelligent reasons.

It annoys me when people are religious for bad reasons, (Fine tuning, Pascals Wager, tradition, etc) , but it also annoys me when people call themselves atheists for badly thought out reasons too

What would you say is a poor reason to be atheist?

I didn't know we had teams. I don't think there is a god, I'll leave it to others to give that a label or determine my intelligence for thinking so.

hey thats cool, and i'm sure you could explain to people on an interlectual basis the reasons for coming to such a conclusion.

I just know people who don't believe just becuase they don't want to and don't care about why they don't believe

i think when intelligent people believe its because they choose to, want to. they've asked the questions and have chosen to believe in the higher power of whatever persuasion.

less intelligent people believe because their parents told them they would go to hell. i know some people that believe just to "hedge their bets" you know, just "in case" there is a god. i always wonder and want to ask them..."but wont you be soo pissed off if you've picked the wrong religion and have been following the wrong set of rules this whole time?" ;-)

I'm curious about your source for this Damon. The line seems a little off. I would expect the slope to be a little less steep due to the block within 5 of the 65% importance range, and between the 100 and 104 IQ range. By my count 18 of the 52 states fall in that range. I'm also curious about the explanation of how North Dakota and Vermont can be so different on religion when their IQs appear to be identical. At the low end, how about Hawaii and Alabama? Same IQ, but a 25% difference in religious importance. All the averages fall within a little over 10 IQ points of each other, is that really a big difference? That's less than a 10% difference in intellegence from one end of the scale to the other. How much difference in intelligence is 10 IQ points?

On another note, all but 4 states consider religion important, although I wonder what that even means. Important in their lives? Important to society? I would argue religion is very important to all American lives. If not Christianity, Islam definitely is. Regardless of whether the average American believes in Islam, the religion, and the actions of it's followers, specifically the extremist followers, affects their lives. It's costing them billions of dollars in war and forcing them to give up privacy in the name of security.

I can't help noticing that all 4 of the "intelligent/non-believing" states are New England states. So, couldn't the argument be made that geography, or perhaps environment factor in religious belief? This graph shows more conclusively that intelligent people tend to live in northern states, than it shows that they don't believe in God.

And lastly, I'll point out that these are averages of entire states measuring two separate things. While all but four states responded that religion is more important than not, we don't actually know whether it was the intelligent or the unintelligent who drove those answers in any one state.

I got 14 out 15. Just didn't get the last one.

I'm as whacked out as you are, dude.

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The best thing you can do for your fellow,
next to rousing his conscience, is - not to give him things
to think about, but to wake things up that are in him...
to make him think things for himself - George MacDonald

I got 13 out of 15, but I guessed on a couple as well. I love multiple choice.

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I had to guess on three as well. Usually I'm pretty good at guessing games, but this time I got all three wrong. D'oh!

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You answered 11 out of 15 questions correctly
for a score of 73%.

11 of 15...then nuns of my catholic school would be slapping me with rulers...heheee!

You answered 13 out of 15 questions correctly for a score of 87%.


My opinion about this subject would be based on anecdotal evidence of the area that I live in. No scientific backing whatsoever.
There are many well off, though not really rich people, who live in my region of the world. Around here it is a bit more backwards than what some may have said or tried to prove. There is a large number of people with masters or doctorate degrees who do rather well for themselves. There are also many business owners who have made quite a name for themselves on a local level. They are driven in their fields and also in their religious convictions. It seems to me, at least in this area, that it is those who are not driven or who do not aspire to be more are predominately atheists.

There are atheists and religious alike throughout all social classes, despite intelligence. As Jebru stated it most likely has to do with geographical location than religion. The religion/intelligence debate is most often brought up by those who have a desire to feel superior to their fellow man. Good luck with that.