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elitfromnorth
Posted: Friday, February 15, 2013 4:15:42 AM

Rank: Brawling Berserker

Joined: 2/12/2012
Posts: 1,620
Location: Burrowed, Norway
The last couple of months there have been a couple of terror scares and threats here in Norway. Lastly a drunk member of Norwegian Defence League(an anti-muslim right wing orginastion) was overheard making concrete plans on bombing the parliment, which caused a nation wide terror alert. Last week all military bases were at threat level A based on NATO intelligence.

What has become more interesting is that the way the Norwegian armed forces aids the police in these matters may actually be against the constitution, in other words illegal. Let's say for the sake of argument that this is true. What is the view of the think tank? Should one ignore the constitution in order to provide maximum safety for the population, even though it's against the constitution, until one gets around to change it? Should it be changed it needs 2/3 of the parliment over two different periods, which means that should it get up to vote before the election in September it can't be changed until then. Considering the efficiency of our politicians I doubt it will happen before then, which means it will take 4 1/2 years before it can be changed. Is it right to ignore the constitution and risk the lives of innocent civilians to provide security?

"It's at that point you realise Lady Luck is actually a hooker, and you're fresh out of cash."
Guest
Posted: Friday, February 15, 2013 5:02:54 AM

Rank: Lurker

Joined: 12/1/2006
Posts: 534,753
Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety." Ben Franklin
Give away any form of Rights Under any Constitution and you never get them back. Ignoring the rule of law is more dangerous then what ever death and damage the terrorist can rain down on you. Never give in, do not change your way of life or they win ,no matter who the terrorist are, they win.
Jack_42
Posted: Friday, February 15, 2013 5:15:59 AM

Rank: Forum Guru

Joined: 8/21/2009
Posts: 986
Location: Prague, Czech Republic
Is this the case? I know that in the UK if a situation justifies it police can enter a building without a warrant etc are there no such provisions within your country's law?
MrNudiePants
Posted: Friday, February 15, 2013 7:22:29 AM

Rank: Forum Guru

Joined: 8/10/2009
Posts: 2,141
Location: United States
It depends. Do you want to live in a nation of laws where fairness matters, or a nation where "might makes right"?

Guest
Posted: Friday, February 15, 2013 8:43:18 AM

Rank: Lurker

Joined: 12/1/2006
Posts: 534,753
Jack_42 wrote:
Is this the case? I know that in the UK if a situation justifies it police can enter a building without a warrant etc are there no such provisions within your country's law?



* Exigent Circumstances *

in the USA it allows for the police to enter a building to protect evidence that other wise would be destroyed and to protect the life of another.
elitfromnorth
Posted: Saturday, February 16, 2013 1:46:49 PM

Rank: Brawling Berserker

Joined: 2/12/2012
Posts: 1,620
Location: Burrowed, Norway
Jack_42 wrote:
Is this the case? I know that in the UK if a situation justifies it police can enter a building without a warrant etc are there no such provisions within your country's law?


Well, I'm guessing that the police are allowed to enter if they hear screaming and then a lot of loud noises from within the building and there's reason to believe that lives may be in danger.

I haven't put myself properly into the case of exactly what part of it might be unconstitutional, but it's not censorship or anything like that. It's how they assisted the police, so as from what I can see it's somewhere along the lines of how far can the armed forces go into the "police job"(lacking a better word) before they break the constitution. Would you be ok with it, given that none of your civil liberties were disrupted or ignored from this process? Meaning you could still browse lush and get off without having to worry about big brother watching you, but you might experience watching armed forces guard certain areas which could be terrorist targets.

"It's at that point you realise Lady Luck is actually a hooker, and you're fresh out of cash."
DLizze
Posted: Monday, February 18, 2013 4:22:38 PM

Rank: Story Verifier

Joined: 4/23/2011
Posts: 2,552
I see this discussion as a simple problem in logic:

A terrorist is, by definition, a law-breaker.
Breaking the law to stop or apprehend him reduces the enforcement and prosecuting agency to his level.
Changing the law to make it legal to apprehend or capture him by means which would have been unconstitutional absent that change in law reduces the entire population to his level.

Therefore, it is wrong to give up liberties to apprehend the individual terrorist.
Someone (I can't recall who) once said, in essence, better that 100 guilty individuals should go free than one innocent person be hanged.

This quotation from the writings of John Adams states the principle more succinctly than I:

It is more important that innocence be protected than it is that guilt be punished, for guilt and crimes are so frequent in this world that they cannot all be punished.... But if innocence itself is brought to the bar and condemned, perhaps to die, then the citizen will say, "whether I do good or whether I do evil is immaterial, for innocence itself is no protection," and if such an idea as that were to take hold in the mind of the citizen that would be the end of security whatsoever.

"There's only three tempos: slow, medium and fast. When you get between in the cracks, ain't nuthin' happenin'." Ben Webster
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