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What's your opinion on abortion? Options · View
overmykneenow
Posted: Wednesday, July 24, 2013 1:05:21 AM

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SexEmporer wrote:
I know. And I feel the same way now.


Wow - for the first time ever did The Think Tank work? Well done everybody - let's sort out gun-control next

Warning: The opinions above are those of an anonymous individual on the internet. They are opinions, unless they're facts. They may be ill-informed, out of touch with reality or just plain stupid. They may contain traces of irony. If reading these opinions causes you to be become outraged or you start displaying the symptoms of outrage, stop reading them immediately. If symptoms persist, consult a psychiatrist.

Why not read some stories instead

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angieseroticpen
Posted: Wednesday, July 24, 2013 2:44:52 AM

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SexEmporer wrote:
Abortion is murder. Sure the mother chooses, but the child has no choice. It still feels pain. It has no say in the matter and is just killed. If you support abortion, you support murder. Plain and simple.



I can see where you coming from in your statement. Abortion is the taking of a life, plain and simple. But the moral question that this raises is why the life has been taken. I have no problem with looking at this from a medical point of view. If the mother's life is at risk or there is a risk that the child's life will be so seriously impaired that the quality of life will be short and painful then that is one thing. If the abortion is undertaken to get rid of an unwanted pregnancy then that is something entirely different.

It never ceases to amaze me that in this day and age of countless and free methods of contraception that women have unwanted pregnancies. I just can't fathom it. You know that when you have sex with a person of the opposite sex that it is also an act of procreation. If you don't want to produce a child then either don't do it or use contraception. Simples!

A few weeks ago I was sent a CV by a woman looking for work. She is single and has three children. Her CV detailed three jobs where she left work because she 'Fell Pregnant'. I ask you, how dumb do you have to be to learn so simple a lesson!



“When one door closes, another opens; but we often look so long and so regretfully upon the closed door that we do not see the one which has opened for us.”
clum
Posted: Wednesday, July 24, 2013 3:33:58 AM

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freakycactus wrote:
Having said that, if I found myself pregnant and wanting to keep the baby when the father didn't, if I felt I could manage as a single parent then I would probably have the baby against his wishes and would repeatedly tell him, 'tough', and I would even tell him that as I would be the one growing the child he could fuck off telling me what to do with my body. A contradiction, I know but it's a very difficult and emotive subject.


I would feel exactly the same way, so I get that, only I wouldn't have the option to say, "Tough!" We can't 'grow' children, so there's immediately a biological inequality, but it would be nice if there were more efforts for equality in the decision-making process.

I really do feel, when it comes to child-bearing, that men get punished for not having a womb. It sucks.

TheDevilsWeakness
Posted: Wednesday, July 24, 2013 8:03:56 AM

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clum wrote:

I really do feel, when it comes to child-bearing, that men get punished for not having a womb. It sucks.


Let me know when you want to have your period and all the lovely things that go with it.
Wicked cramps, crazy food cravings, bloating, your boobs hurt, along with every joint in your body, the migraine headaches and then add the fluctuating hormones and wild mood swings. (I've been known to be homicidal)
Then BAM... Menopause. Just when you thought things couldn't get any worse. It does. The only good thing that comes from menopause is Niagara frickin Falls finally dries up.

Now, I'm not picking on you Clum. I'm really not. But I've been on both sides of the abortion fence. Most (in my experience) men haven't the faintest idea the shit women go through on a monthly basis. Let alone what we have to go through when we're pregnant. Add in the losers that point the finger at you and call you a lying, cheating bitch cause you used protection but it failed, to the assholes that walk away at the first sign of any responsibility. Women have to be strong whether we want to be or not. And if that means taking on the difficult decision of abortion, adoption, or becoming a single mom. So be it.

I raised my daughter alone. Without help or assistance from her sperm donor. She doesn't know him. And I hope she never does. He showed his true colors when I found out I was pregnant and told him. I don't want that kind of person to taint her outlook on life or people.

But hey... If a guy wants to step up to the plate and support me emotionally while I decide what to do with my body, then I'll be eternally grateful. Instead of being belittled, forced and cajoled into doing something that could possibly haunt me for the rest of my life.

I regret nothing. I was totally at peace with myself as I walked through a crowd of protesters to enter the abortion clinic. Even though they did everything in their power to dissuade me by calling me a whore and a murdering piece of shit and God hated me. I might've wavered for an instant if some compassion was shown, but they only reinforced my resolve by their disgusting display of hate and fear mongering.

If that makes me a bad person in the eyes of others, then I'm quite okay with that. I don't really care what those kinds of people think of me, as long as I'm okay with me.

AriOli101
Posted: Wednesday, July 24, 2013 8:12:13 AM

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TheDevilsWeakness wrote:


Let me know when you want to have your period and all the lovely things that go with it.
Wicked cramps, crazy food cravings, bloating, your boobs hurt, along with every joint in your body, the migraine headaches and then add the fluctuating hormones and wild mood swings. (I've been known to be homicidal)
Then BAM... Menopause. Just when you thought things couldn't get any worse. It does. The only good thing that comes from menopause is Niagara frickin Falls finally dries up.

Now, I'm not picking on you Clum. I'm really not. But I've been on both sides of the abortion fence. Most (in my experience) men haven't the faintest idea the shit women go through on a monthly basis. Let alone what we have to go through when we're pregnant. Add in the losers that point the finger at you and call you a lying, cheating bitch cause you used protection but it failed, to the assholes that walk away at the first sign of any responsibility. Women have to be strong whether we want to be or not. And if that means taking on the difficult decision of abortion, adoption, or becoming a single mom. So be it.

I raised my daughter alone. Without help or assistance from her sperm donor. She doesn't know him. And I hope she never does. He showed his true colors when I found out I was pregnant and told him. I don't want that kind of person to taint her outlook on life or people.

But hey... If a guy wants to step up to the plate and support me emotionally while I decide what to do with my body, then I'll be eternally grateful. Instead of being belittled, forced and cajoled into doing something that could possibly haunt me for the rest of my life.

I regret nothing. I was totally at peace with myself as I walked through a crowd of protesters to enter the abortion clinic. Even though they did everything in their power to dissuade me by calling me a whore and a murdering piece of shit and God hated me. I might've wavered for an instant if some compassion was shown, but they only reinforced my resolve by their disgusting display of hate and fear mongering.

If that makes me a bad person in the eyes of others, then I'm quite okay with that. I don't really care what those kinds of people think of me, as long as I'm okay with me.


Big Hugs

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clum
Posted: Wednesday, July 24, 2013 8:20:25 AM

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TheDevilsWeakness wrote:
Let me know when you want to have your period and all the lovely things that go with it.
Wicked cramps, crazy food cravings, bloating, your boobs hurt, along with every joint in your body, the migraine headaches and then add the fluctuating hormones and wild mood swings. (I've been known to be homicidal)
Then BAM... Menopause. Just when you thought things couldn't get any worse. It does. The only good thing that comes from menopause is Niagara frickin Falls finally dries up.


My point is, it's not our fault that we don't have periods, don't go through menopause and can't bear children—we have no choice in that. Yet it is still seen as a perfectly acceptable reason (by both sexes) to box men out of important decisions that affect them just as much*. Because of something we have no control over, our opinions matter less.

It takes two people to make a baby, and both should take equal responsibility, including making a decision on abortion.

If I could have the ability to carry children in exchange for cramps, cravings, migraines and everything that goes along with a woman's monthly cycle and pregnancy, you bet your sweet ass I'd be all over that deal like a rash. It's not an option we have, so don't punish us for being male.

*Sorry, not "just as much" physically and biologically, but which still has a huge impact on their life.

Guest
Posted: Wednesday, July 24, 2013 8:24:07 AM

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clum wrote:


I really do feel, when it comes to child-bearing, that men get punished for not having a womb. It sucks.


Boo hoo!
TheDevilsWeakness
Posted: Wednesday, July 24, 2013 8:25:41 AM

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clum wrote:

My point is, it's not our fault that we don't have periods, don't go through menopause and can't bear children—we have no choice in that. Yet it is still seen as a perfectly acceptable reason (by both sexes) to box men out of important decisions that affect them just as much. Because of something we have no control over, our opinions matter less.

It takes two people to make a baby, and both should take equal responsibility, including making a decision on abortion.

If I could have the ability to carry children in exchange for cramps, cravings, migraines and everything that goes along with a woman's monthly cycle and pregnancy, you bet your sweet ass I'd be all over that deal like a rash. It's not an option we have, so don't punish us for being male.


And all I'm saying is don't punish us for being female by taking away our choice for a safe place to decide whether or not to have an abortion.

For the record, if I had someone in my life to support me when I had to make that decision, you can bet your sweet ass I more than likely would not have went with that option. But as it stands the only bad decision I made then was my choice in men. I'm hopeful that there is more men out there like you Clum. You're one of the good guys.

clum
Posted: Wednesday, July 24, 2013 8:28:48 AM

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brigit wrote:
Boo hoo!


It's that attitude that has gotten me very angry in the past. Women led and are leading a huge movement for gender equality, but usually only in spheres where they (often rightly) feel they are hard done by and not in areas where men are at the disadvantage.

clum
Posted: Wednesday, July 24, 2013 8:35:39 AM

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TheDevilsWeakness wrote:
And all I'm saying is don't punish us for being female by taking away our choice for a safe place to decide whether or not to have an abortion.


You're still putting across the (widespread) attitude that it's ultimately up to the woman, and that's my real bone of contention. The decision to abort should be made by the parents, not the mother.

Like I said before, it's an idealised view in which fewer potential fathers are such responsibility-shirking assholes not willing to have an adult conversation about the situation.

Blame us for being jerks, but not for being male.

Guest
Posted: Wednesday, July 24, 2013 8:41:22 AM

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clum wrote:


It's that attitude that has gotten me very angry in the past. Women led and are leading a huge movement for gender equality, but usually only in spheres where they (often rightly) feel they are hard done by and not in areas where men are at the disadvantage.


I'm sorry, but when I look at the state of women's reproductive rights around the world world it makes me very angry too.
TheDevilsWeakness
Posted: Wednesday, July 24, 2013 8:43:14 AM

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clum wrote:


You're still putting across the (widespread) attitude that it's ultimately up to the woman, and that's my real bone of contention. The decision to abort should be made by the parents, not the mother.

Like I said before, it's an idealised view in which fewer potential fathers are such responsibility-shirking assholes not willing to have an adult conversation about the situation.

Blame us for being jerks, but not for being male.


You missed the entire point. Men have the ability to walk away scott free. Women don't.

VanGogh
Posted: Wednesday, July 24, 2013 8:43:25 AM

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clum wrote:

It takes two people to make a baby, and both should take equal responsibility, including making a decision on abortion.


Should ...... but when it comes to the urge of sex .................. shoulds are often said the next day, next week, next month.

I wish more men would just wear a fucking condom. I wish more men would respect women ..... stop the raping, stop the assumption that their sperm is supreme in the decision making, stop thinking that they wear the pants. Fuck, I wish more women respected their gender and be non-judgmental!!

Responsibility ..... women seem to have had to take the burden of unwanted pregnancies (for whatever reason) and, thank fucking god, there are safe procedures now so that women SURVIVE the coat hanger ordeal.

I hope no one else has to feel they need to disclose their personal experiences (Sprite/DW/etc) to get their point across as to why pro-choice/abortions has been an option.

This world needs a little more compassion.

May you never NEED to have an abortion, < insert name > but should you need one, there are counselors, health professionals and communities that will support you in obtaining a safe procedure so you can live again.


clum
Posted: Wednesday, July 24, 2013 8:49:32 AM

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brigit wrote:
I'm sorry, but when I look at the state of women's reproductive rights around the world world it makes me very angry too.


But I haven't actually expressed any opinion on that whatsoever. I apologise if I have somehow given you the impression that I am against the improvement of women's reproductive rights around the world; it was never my intention.

AriOli101
Posted: Wednesday, July 24, 2013 8:54:58 AM

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PersonalAssistant wrote:

I wish more men would just wear a fucking condom. I wish more men would respect women ..... stop the raping, stop the assumption that their sperm is supreme in the decision making, stop thinking that they wear the pants. Fuck, I wish more women respected their gender and be non-judgmental!!


Sexism goes both ways here. thanks for pointing that out :)

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freakycactus
Posted: Wednesday, July 24, 2013 9:05:10 AM

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clum wrote:


But I haven't actually expressed any opinion on that whatsoever. I apologise if I have somehow given you the impression that I am against the improvement of women's reproductive rights around the world; it was never my intention.


The problem is, Clum, you're a sensible person who is capable of acting like an adult sensitive to the feelings of others. If everyone was the same it would make the world a better and simpler place. Unfortunately, you know what sort of a world we live in and things are messy and complicated.

In an ideal world people would be able to find a compromise that works for both of them. The reality is that too many people have tried for too long to control women and our bodies. People, mainly men, are still trying and we have to listen to people like Jeremy Hunt tell us the abortion limit should be 12 weeks, in Texas they want to make it 6 weeks.

We have to fight so hard to maintain our rights over our reproductive health and the fact is that we are the ones who grow and give birth to children. That's a wonderful thing is the child is wanted but if they aren't then you are left with a woman giving her body to a growing parasite. It's little wonder that final say falls to the woman. Is it fair? Maybe not but neither is life.

I know that you're more than aware of that Clum and most of what I've said isn't aimed at you, so I hope I haven't offended you :)
clum
Posted: Wednesday, July 24, 2013 9:05:54 AM

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TheDevilsWeakness wrote:
You missed the entire point. Men have the ability to walk away scott free. Women don't.


Isn't it sad that men have that ability though? I wish it weren't the case. But where an abortion is possible, don't women have that same option?

Yeah, men should be more accountable. But because their opinion isn't deemed as important as the mother's, they don't feel they have the same level of responsibility.

All too often, there's no discussion and it just comes down to what she wants. No, he shouldn't be allowed to just walk away from it all and leave her to get on with it. Nor should he have been alienated from the decision to have a child and then forced to go along with it.

clum
Posted: Wednesday, July 24, 2013 9:16:41 AM

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freakycactus wrote:
The problem is, Clum, you're a sensible person who is capable of acting like an adult sensitive to the feelings of others. If everyone was the same it would make the world a better and simpler place. Unfortunately, you know what sort of a world we live in and things are messy and complicated.

I know that you're more than aware of that Clum and most of what I've said isn't aimed at you, so I hope I haven't offended you :)


(Sorry everyone for posting so much).

I'm not suggesting that it will ever be as straightforward as I have portrayed it, but that we should move towards this model whereby the opinions of both potential parents are equally valued and respected. Before we can get there, of course we need to address the many failings of men.

In reality, often women have to make tougher decisions, and go through greater hardships. Men, relatively speaking, have it easy, but they shouldn't!

Neither sex should use the fact that men can't carry children as an excuse for them not to take equal responsibility for an unborn child/foetus. It's not an excuse for men to walk away, and it's not an excuse for women to ignore their opinion.

I haven't been offended by anyone who has replied to me. I only hope I have managed to, as clearly as possible, express what I'm trying to say without offending others (sorry if I have).

Guest
Posted: Wednesday, July 24, 2013 9:20:52 AM

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PersonalAssistant wrote:

I wish more men would just wear a fucking condom. I wish more men would respect women ..... stop the raping, stop the assumption that their sperm is supreme in the decision making, stop thinking that they wear the pants. Fuck, I wish more women respected their gender and be non-judgmental!!
I see what you're saying here. And I like how you didn't just say something about one sex. And I agree with you. What's the point of rape? Honestly why would a person do it? And more women should respect their gender. It's a messed up world we live in. And all we can do is our best and hope that others will do the same. And hell, maybe someday it may happen that both genders are equal and men only didn't wear condoms when the woman agreed, and there was no rape, and women respected their gender, and were non-judgemental. But until that day, it's people like you who will be the best to spread the word of equality. If you're not pointing toward equality, then correct me.
Guest
Posted: Wednesday, July 24, 2013 9:25:02 AM

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clum wrote:


(Sorry everyone for posting so much).

I'm not suggesting that it will ever be as straightforward as I have portrayed it, but that we should move towards this model whereby the opinions of both potential parents are equally valued and respected. Before we can get there, of course we need to address the many failings of men.

In reality, often women have to make tougher decisions, and go through greater hardships. Men, relatively speaking, have it easy, but they shouldn't!

Neither sex should use the fact that men can't carry children as an excuse for them not to take equal responsibility for an unborn child/foetus. It's not an excuse for men to walk away, and it's not an excuse for women to ignore their opinion.

I haven't been offended by anyone who has replied to me. I only hope I have managed to, as clearly as possible, express what I'm trying to say without offending others (sorry if I have).
I agree with you. Men shouldn't have it as easy as we do. But we do. And I wish more women would involve men in the decision of whether or not to abort. And I also wish that more men would step up to the plate and take the responsibility instead of making the woman feel like she has to bear it alone. But there are good people out there. Like you and PersonalAssistant. And I wish there were more people out there like the two of you.
AriOli101
Posted: Wednesday, July 24, 2013 9:44:08 AM

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SexEmporer wrote:
I agree with you. Men shouldn't have it as easy as we do. But we do. And I wish more women would involve men in the decision of whether or not to abort. And I also wish that more men would step up to the plate and take the responsibility instead of making the woman feel like she has to bear it alone. But there are good people out there. Like you and PersonalAssistant. And I wish there were more people out there like the two of you.


Big Hugs You sound like you've grown up a lot since 3 pages back :)

Proud of you Embarassed

Also, I totally agree. If you're gonna have sex, you need to be comfortable enough with your partner to say the most difficult things.

Make love not horcruxes! >^_^<

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Guest
Posted: Wednesday, July 24, 2013 9:52:38 AM

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AriOli101 wrote:


Big Hugs You sound like you've grown up a lot since 3 pages back :)

Proud of you Embarassed

Also, I totally agree. If you're gonna have sex, you need to be comfortable enough with your partner to say the most difficult things.
Thanks. I have come to realize a lot. And I agree. If you want to have sex with someone, be prepared for all outcomes.
Guest
Posted: Wednesday, July 24, 2013 9:52:54 AM

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clum wrote:


But I haven't actually expressed any opinion on that whatsoever. I apologise if I have somehow given you the impression that I am against the improvement of women's reproductive rights around the world; it was never my intention.


In the US we do have a legal right to abortion, but millions of women don't really have easy access. There are states with only one or two abortion providers (anti-choice activists make it a dangerous job), and travelling long distances is no simple thing for lots of people. So, my frustration comes from the fact that lots of women, even here, don't have much say so, and it seems, from my perspective, that men already have lots of power to control choice. The majority of politicians that are chipping away at reproductive rights are men. But I agree, in a perfect world, it would be a decision made by both potential parents. occasion5
Dani
Posted: Wednesday, July 24, 2013 10:10:54 AM

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clum wrote:
I only have one thing to say on the issue of abortion:

I wish, when the decision on whether to abort a pregnancy or not is being made, that the father had just as much a say in it as the mother (in the cases where the father is around and not some deadbeat asshole, obviously).

"But it's her body!" I know. I get that, but saying that it's ultimately up to her, whatever he thinks, is punishing a man for being male. We can't carry children; that's not our choice. You're both equally parents of that unborn child/foetus. You would (hopefully) play an equal role in raising the child, so I (strongly) believe this part should be the same.

If I had slept with a woman, whether wife or one-night stand, and she got pregnant then decided she was going to have an abortion, I would be devastated/heartbroken/irate. I would beg her to keep it, even if it meant me raising it on my own. As it stands, if she is resolved to have an abortion, there's not really anything I can do to stop her. That makes me sad and angry.

That's pretty much my only opinion on the issue of abortion.


(If there's a health risk to the mother, it's a different scenario, of course. I'm working on the assumption of a "typical" pregnancy.)


I completely understand where you're coming from. And I admire your stance. I believe it comes from an honest and sincere place, and it makes me proud to know there are men out there like you that exist.

But here's the thing: Abortion is a decision most women are left to make alone. I can almost guarantee you that no woman would ever tell any man willing to support her and the child in question, "Fuck you, I'm getting rid of it." The reason women make the decision alone is because they're usually left with no other choice but to make it alone. That's the reality of the situation.

Maybe I'm crazy, but I'd like to believe that even the most callous of women wouldn't get an abortion if they didn't have to. So I don't think it's about vindictive women leaving potential fathers out of the decision making process of an abortion. I think it's more about potential 'fathers' not having any input because they choose not to have any input.

And sure, I've heard of cases where relationships end for whatever reason and the woman finds out she's pregnant by the guy and goes through with an abortion without stopping to even consider that he wants to be a dad. I've also heard of different scenarios that are a lot like these. Meaning that a woman may exclude him from the process out of spite. I think that a potential father is at least entitled to hear, no matter how estranged he and the mother may be, that "Hey, I'm pregnant. Where do we go from here?" instead of hearing from you or from some outside source that you've had an abortion.

As I said, I honestly believe that if women know that they'll have some type of support from the father, then she's less likely to go through with an abortion...and even less likely to exclude him from the decision of having an abortion.

I still believe our bodies are our bodies and we should be able to govern them accordingly, but when a piece of you contributes to something growing inside of me, then I should at least have the decency to let you be a part of any decision I make...should you have a desire to be a part of that decision.



MadMartigan
Posted: Wednesday, July 24, 2013 11:09:27 AM

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clum wrote:


You're still putting across the (widespread) attitude that it's ultimately up to the woman, and that's my real bone of contention. The decision to abort should be made by the parents, not the mother.

Like I said before, it's an idealised view in which fewer potential fathers are such responsibility-shirking assholes not willing to have an adult conversation about the situation.

Blame us for being jerks, but not for being male.


And if the man doesn't want the woman to abort (and she feels strongly that she wants to and has good reasons) should the male have the right to manipulate and twist things to get her to keep something she doesn't want? You run into a sticky situation. I don't think it's fair to guilt trip women into something they don't want and fair or not, it isn't something you have to go through physically and emotionally.

And I may be a male, but males will continually be put in a bad light for anti-abortion movements when 80% of the legislature in the US is filled with cantankerous old men trying to make laws over what a person can and cannot do with their own body...That's the crux of the angst and the issues. They are not only taking away abortion, but family planning as well. Again, the real issue isn't abortion. It's every other fucked up thing that needs to be fixed. Economic disparity, support disparity, and so on and so forth.


I hear there's a machine or somesuch out there that can replicate somewhat the process of birthing.

Get hooked up on that machine, then decide on your views is what I'd say.

If an all female panel tried to regulate the penis and all things heretofore, there'd be even more uproar.
clum
Posted: Wednesday, July 24, 2013 5:11:40 PM

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Maybe sharing a little experience will help people understand me. Maybe.

I've never, to the very best of my knowledge, impregnated a woman. However, in my previous relationship, we did discuss what we would do were our contraceptive measures to fail. We were both in the middle of our degree courses at the time.

I said that I would want to keep the child, should she fall pregnant, and that I would be happy to be its primary care-giver so that she could finish university. However, she said that she would be strongly discouraged from having a child while in full time education and that it could potentially damage her relationships with members of her family. She was scared of the prospect of becoming a parent, and even more scared at how ready I was to do so.

I explained to her that, though it would be very upsetting to miss out on that opportunity to become a parent, I wouldn't expect her to do anything that she felt jeopardised her future or her family relations. In the end, we resolved to use more contraception and be even more vigilant against unexpected pregnancy, so that we would never have to deal with that potentially heartbreaking situation.

This is the kind of dialogue I want to encourage between people in a sexual relationship or who find themselves unexpectedly pregnant. Both parties felt their views were listened to and valued, and a solution was found that suited them both with no detrimental effects to the relationship.


As I've thought about this more throughout the day, I think I've actually been rather short-sighted.

You know what I really want? I want to live in a world where abortion isn't illegal, but unnecessary. I want us, as a society, to develop and transform to the point where unexpected pregnancies simply don't happen.

To get to that point, attitudes to sex and relationships need to change, and we would need to abolish rape.

I'm going to work towards that. :)

AngelHeart01
Posted: Wednesday, July 24, 2013 11:51:16 PM

Rank: Forum Guru

Joined: 4/23/2010
Posts: 3,213
Location: ♥ Southern Style ♥, United States
I'm personally Pro-life
Ruthie
Posted: Thursday, July 25, 2013 2:04:09 AM

Rank: Moderator Emeritus
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Joined: 10/21/2010
Posts: 3,671
Location: The wilder parts. , United States
clum wrote:


(Sorry everyone for posting so much).

I'm not suggesting that it will ever be as straightforward as I have portrayed it, but that we should move towards this model whereby the opinions of both potential parents are equally valued and respected. Before we can get there, of course we need to address the many failings of men.



If a woman is pregnant, her opinion is the only one that matters. Of course the prospective father can voice an opinion, but he can't be allowed to make the choice. A woman doesn't need the man who got her pregnant laying off guilt on her for choosing an abortion. That's basically what the father's opinion amounts to if it is anything but, "I'll support you in whatever you decide to do."

My body, my choice, doesn't mean my body and everyone else gets a vote. The opinions of both potential parents can't be equally respected because only one of them has to carry the child for nine months. What if the potential father wanted the mother to have an abortion, would his opinion have equal value in that as well.

We are getting very close to having abortion made impossible in a lot of places. Arguments about the father's place in abortion decisions just muddies the issue and gives the anti-choice types more ammunition. They are deadly serious about stopping all legal abortions. They work at it a lot harder than the pro-choice people, are more dedicated and have lots of money from people like the Koch brothers, they also have a majority in a lot of state legislatures, as well as the U.S. House of Representatives.

ByronLord
Posted: Thursday, July 25, 2013 6:07:38 AM

Rank: Forum Guru
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Joined: 11/14/2010
Posts: 835
Location: Massachusetts, United States
I think abortion is icky but the anti-abortion jihadis are so obnoxious and unpleasant that I support a woman's right to an abortion just to spite them.

VanGogh
Posted: Thursday, July 25, 2013 7:35:10 AM

Rank: Sarcastic Coffee Aficionado

Joined: 2/10/2012
Posts: 3,928
Location: Vancouver, Canada
Ruthie wrote:

We are getting very close to having abortion made impossible in a lot of places. Arguments about the father's place in abortion decisions just muddies the issue and gives the anti-choice types more ammunition. They are deadly serious about stopping all legal abortions. They work at it a lot harder than the pro-choice people, are more dedicated and have lots of money from people like the Koch brothers, they also have a majority in a lot of state legislatures, as well as the U.S. House of Representatives.


This makes me sick. Literally. My stomach just turned.

Apparently some people want woman to return to feeling like an utter fucking whore for deciding to abort a fetus ------ oh and to return to coat hangers for the "safe and effective" way in which to abort a fetus (at usually LESS THAN 9 WEEKS!).

How far had we come to 1973? Tremendous amount. The health of women were PROTECTED.

Quote:
Roe v. Wade, 410 U.S. 113 (1973), is a landmark decision by the United States Supreme Court on the issue of abortion. Decided simultaneously with a companion case, Doe v. Bolton, the Court ruled 7–2 that a right to privacy under the due process clause of the 14th Amendment extended to a woman's decision to have an abortion, but that right must be balanced against the state's two legitimate interests in regulating abortions: protecting prenatal life and protecting women's health. Arguing that these state interests became stronger over the course of a pregnancy, the Court resolved this balancing test by tying state regulation of abortion to the trimester of pregnancy.

The Court later rejected Roe's trimester framework, while affirming Roe's central holding that a person has a right to abortion until viability. The Roe decision defined "viable" as being "potentially able to live outside the mother's womb, albeit with artificial aid", adding that viability "is usually placed at about seven months (28 weeks) but may occur earlier, even at 24 weeks."

In disallowing many state and federal restrictions on abortion in the United States, Roe v. Wade prompted a national debate that continues today, about issues including whether and to what extent abortion should be legal, who should decide the legality of abortion, what methods the Supreme Court should use in constitutional adjudication, and what the role should be of religious and moral views in the political sphere. Roe v. Wade reshaped national politics, dividing much of the United States into pro-choice and pro-life camps, while activating grassroots movements on both sides.


I wonder how people would feel if there were lobbyists out there working to abolish the Civil Rights Movement (1954) and return to desegregation to society?? (example - education below - I won't bore you with the other statutes of desegregation acts)

Quote:
Brown v. Board of Education, 347 U.S. 483 (1954), was a landmark United States Supreme Court case in which the Court declared state laws establishing separate public schools for black and white students unconstitutional. The decision overturned the Plessy v. Ferguson decision of 1896, which allowed state-sponsored segregation, insofar as it applied to public education. Handed down on May 17, 1954, the Warren Court's unanimous (9–0) decision stated that "separate educational facilities are inherently unequal." As a result, de jure racial segregation was ruled a violation of the Equal Protection Clause of the Fourteenth Amendment of the United States Constitution. This ruling paved the way for integration and was a major victory of the civil rights movement.


That's how I equate legalized abortion AND civil rights .................... they are ONE and the SAME!

Oh right, I am just a woman in Canada .... angry7

Stopping evolved civil rights (as in the availability of a safe procedure) is disrespectful and repressive.


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