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Can you truly trust a person after they cheat? Options · View
lacr0236
Posted: Saturday, February 1, 2014 2:05:17 PM

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Location: South East, United States
Long story made short... the wife and I had a mmf. Before hand the ground rules were set up that I had to be present/aware if at any time after they were going get together. And I was to be told of any messages, texts, or calls. I later find out my wife has deleted many texts and set up a rendezvous with him while I was out of town. "She forgot to delete a message to one of her girlfriends" she said that the talked about doing it but didn't. And says that they never did it when I wasn't there... how can I believe her. It has been 2 years now and I still don't completely trust her... Can I really ever trust her again? She says that she is different now and will never risk "us" again, but is still friends with him even though I wanted her to break all contact when I found out. Am I asking to be hurt again?
dpw
Posted: Saturday, February 1, 2014 8:26:53 PM

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Location: Liverpool, United Kingdom
lacr0236 wrote:
Long story made short... the wife and I had a mmf. Before hand the ground rules were set up that I had to be present/aware if at any time after they were going get together. And I was to be told of any messages, texts, or calls. I later find out my wife has deleted many texts and set up a rendezvous with him while I was out of town. "She forgot to delete a message to one of her girlfriends" she said that the talked about doing it but didn't. And says that they never did it when I wasn't there... how can I believe her. It has been 2 years now and I still don't completely trust her... Can I really ever trust her again? She says that she is different now and will never risk "us" again, but is still friends with him even though I wanted her to break all contact when I found out. Am I asking to be hurt again?

My view is no you can never trust a person who has cheated. It doesn't mean that they will cheat again but the possibility is always there.
I think your case shows the dangers of bringing a third person into a relationship. I'm curious to know if you already knew the guy and who suggested the 3some.
As for asking to get hurt again, that depends on how likely it is that she might cheat again. Only you can answer that one.
lacr0236
Posted: Saturday, February 1, 2014 9:47:47 PM

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Location: South East, United States
Yes, we already knew him. As far as the who suggested. One day the wife asked me " know what I've been thinking about" and I very jokingly said swapping. And surprisingly she said she was game. I was very surprised. She brought up a couple we knew "J" & "T". Both our age kids etc. I found "T" very attractive. My wife brought it up to "J". They had tried before but the guy had too much to drink and could not get it up so "T" did not want to try again. I kind of got guilt tripped by my wife into the mmf.
Guest
Posted: Sunday, February 2, 2014 12:46:31 AM

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Joined: 12/1/2006
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I dont think so.. Cheating is a deal breaker for me. I would much rather my partner come to me and let me know that he is interested in someone else rather than to find out that he had carrying on for an extended period of time, giving me false sense that all is well..Once that trust is broken, you wonder when ARE they telling the truth.. If you lied about your affair, how do I know you are not lying about loving me? I couldnt.
Guest
Posted: Sunday, February 2, 2014 12:59:26 AM

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Joined: 12/1/2006
Posts: 779,511
I can't speak for you and your wife. I do hope you can re-establish your trust and faith, but just speaking for myself, when I realize someone is not being honest with me, I can only bid them goodbye. I might still interact with them, but I would never be able to trust that person again. Add in the fact the issue in this case is based on their fidelity... no... I don't see myself being forgiving or trusting.
2706ali
Posted: Monday, February 3, 2014 4:20:19 PM

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Location: London, United Kingdom
As much as I would like to think it will all be ok, I very much doubt it .
From my own personal experience my wife wasn't prepared to give up her lover and as a result I left the marriage ,knowing I could never trust her again.
desperado24
Posted: Thursday, February 6, 2014 2:05:14 PM

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Location: Canada
not really u need some time but he or she deserves a chance to prove love for u . u cannot take fast decision in such maters but don't believe too much.......
lacr0236
Posted: Thursday, February 6, 2014 9:26:39 PM

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Joined: 7/30/2011
Posts: 111
Location: South East, United States
Thank you all for the responses. It has been two and a half years, I still don't fully trust her. I hope that this will change, I keep waiting for her to try to do something, anything to make me able to believe and trust her. But all I see and hear from her is I should be over this by now.
GreyHound
Posted: Friday, February 7, 2014 10:31:39 AM

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Joined: 1/28/2014
Posts: 278
no, you can't ... it's like a glass, once the trust is broken it can never be replaced ....

Bunny12
Posted: Thursday, February 20, 2014 10:37:02 PM

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Location: My own little world, United States
Here's a completely different opinion for you. She obviously loves you because she is with you not him. Think of how fantastic it would be if you both trusted each other enough to have a more open relationship so you both could explore you sexual fantasies together and sometimes with other people. What's good for the goose is good for the gander and swingers are some of the nicest people we have met. It's actually more fun when you're in a group situation with your spouse. You have to be able to view sex and love as too different things or it won't work. As long as you are suspicious and waiting for disaster, though you may have reason to be, it will eat away at you and drive you both apart. Some serious communication is needed between you two for sure to resolve anything. Good luck!

Bunny12


Bunny Rabbits cute and fuzzy they want to love you but they have razor sharp teeth - don't piss them off!
Guest
Posted: Thursday, February 20, 2014 10:55:56 PM

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Joined: 12/1/2006
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No.
LASARDaddy
Posted: Thursday, February 20, 2014 11:30:05 PM

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Location: Windsor, United States
Everything is based on trust. If you do then believe her. If you don't then don't believe her.

This is something you have to decide yourself. You know her very well. Think about this very hard. Talk to her about it and be very honest with her. If she lies you will most likely see it if you pay attention to her mannerisms. No one can tell you exactly what to look for, just something not usual when certain questions get asked.

DO NOT start this with the preconceived notion that she MAY be lying. That sets you up for that to be true. Go in feeling that she's telling the truth and you'll get better results.

We went through something similar about 35 years ago and after I did what I explained I decided she was telling the truth. We're still together and I absolutely trust her.

I hope it works for both of you.

I am always a gentleman.
MidnightStrikesUsAll
Posted: Sunday, February 23, 2014 5:32:24 PM

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LASARDaddy wrote:
Everything is based on trust. If you do then believe her. If you don't then don't believe her.

This is something you have to decide yourself. You know her very well. Think about this very hard. Talk to her about it and be very honest with her. If she lies you will most likely see it if you pay attention to her mannerisms. No one can tell you exactly what to look for, just something not usual when certain questions get asked.

DO NOT start this with the preconceived notion that she MAY be lying. That sets you up for that to be true. Go in feeling that she's telling the truth and you'll get better results.

We went through something similar about 35 years ago and after I did what I explained I decided she was telling the truth. We're still together and I absolutely trust her.

I hope it works for both of you.


Bingo. This is fantastic advice.

You know your wife better then anyone else, you should just take the time and effort to work out if she's lying or not.

Now for my own twist from my experience.
I'd literally be here for hours typing the full story for context reasons but a super short version is this...

I lost my V to my first love, but she cheated on her then boyfriend to have sex with me. First and biggest mistake.
I was so blinded by my feelings that I ignored the fact they could still be sleeping together after we got together, then we had a threesome together.
We broke contact from him and made a life together. I found out she'd cheated on me with various women, then she had the audacity to lie about cheating to me, she lied that she'd cheated. She done the whole crying 'I don't want to hurt you' crap but I found out the truth.
We broke up 2am christmas morning 2011 after nearly 5 years together and she lied to me about where she was, she moved in with another guy on christmas morning!
Anyway they got engaged, she came back to me when he was cheating on her and cheated on him with me. She moved back in for two months after 11 months apart and I found her in bed with another guy on new years day, 1/1/13.

Needless to say, anyone who breaks my trust again is history, I allowed myself to be a doormat because of just how truely madly in love I was with this woman, she just couldn't grab the concept of love, she's like a magpie, always after the shiney new things.

But I couldn't be happier to have a girl I can truely trust now, so...silver lining!

Good luck my friend, just don't become a doormat to a compulsive liar, it's not fun!
WellMadeMale
Posted: Monday, February 24, 2014 10:42:11 AM

Rank: Constant Gardener

Joined: 9/30/2009
Posts: 10,757
Location: Cakeland, United States
lacr0236 wrote:
Long story made short... the wife and I had a mmf. Before hand the ground rules were set up that I had to be present/aware if at any time after they were going get together. And I was to be told of any messages, texts, or calls. I later find out my wife has deleted many texts and set up a rendezvous with him while I was out of town. "She forgot to delete a message to one of her girlfriends" she said that the talked about doing it but didn't. And says that they never did it when I wasn't there... how can I believe her. It has been 2 years now and I still don't completely trust her... Can I really ever trust her again? She says that she is different now and will never risk "us" again, but is still friends with him even though I wanted her to break all contact when I found out. Am I asking to be hurt again?


So where has the cheating occurred?

By your own admission - you pushed her into a mutually willing M/F/M sexual interlude - with a known acquaintance. You were present during this sexual encounter.

Are you calling this - cheating?

Just because you think you caught her trying to set up a rendezvous, which she hasn't denied - but claims that nothing occurred when they met up...

Does not mean that you caught her cheating on you.

It really just means that your own insecurities are fucking with your head. You are suspecting and it's eating you up.

Remember - you instigated this entire ordeal, which your wife apparently was agreeable to pursuing...and maybe even breaking the ground rules to pursue again - without you being present.

You don't really divulge how long you two have known each other, but I'd tend to give someone I'd known over 3 years, a major benefit of any doubt of her veracity. But that's just me.

You have to know - your wife or partner and have discussed all the parameters involved. To do so otherwise results in the jacked up feelings you are experiencing now.

Your alternative now is to stay with her and trust her... or what, divorce her and deal with all that shit too.

Obscenity is the last refuge of an inarticulate motherfucker.
hayley
Posted: Monday, February 24, 2014 11:26:49 AM

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Joined: 11/19/2012
Posts: 4,613
Location: NYC, United States
nooooo... once the commitment is broken.. it is broken... u can mend a broken glass but the break is always visible.. and u wonder always will the mend hold... u hope it will but u don't 100% trust it..

lacr0236
Posted: Monday, February 24, 2014 4:55:24 PM

Rank: Forum Guru

Joined: 7/30/2011
Posts: 111
Location: South East, United States
WellMadeMale wrote:


So where has the cheating occurred?

By your own admission - you pushed her into a mutually willing M/F/M sexual interlude - with a known acquaintance. You were present during this sexual encounter.

Are you calling this - cheating?

Just because you think you caught her trying to set up a rendezvous, which she hasn't denied - but claims that nothing occurred when they met up...

Does not mean that you caught her cheating on you.

It really just means that your own insecurities are fucking with your head. You are suspecting and it's eating you up.

Remember - you instigated this entire ordeal, which your wife apparently was agreeable to pursuing...and maybe even breaking the ground rules to pursue again - without you being present.

You don't really divulge how long you two have known each other, but I'd tend to give someone I'd known over 3 years, a major benefit of any doubt of her veracity. But that's just me.

You have to know - your wife or partner and have discussed all the parameters involved. To do so otherwise results in the jacked up feelings you are experiencing now.

Your alternative now is to stay with her and trust her... or what, divorce her and deal with all that shit too.


Ok. Yes my insecurities are fucking with my head and being suspicious has been eating me up, of that I do not deny one bit. However I did not "push" her into the mmf. Believe it or not she brought it up. In hindsight made me wonder if things may have been happening before I was brought in.(yes insecurity) Sorry not previously listed one "ground rule" was I was to know about any texts from him. No I was not looking for transcripts or asking to read them, I wanted to be aware. I was very certain she was hiding texts but I wanted to believe her and with no proof (since it was deleted) I kept giving her the benefit of the doubt. So to me breaking of the rules is cheating, her telling me when I confronted her about the missing texts that she got rid of them since she "knew it would make me mad" to me proved this was a willing intended deception. We have been married 14 yrs, 12 at the time this happened. My wife was the one who set up when we were meeting etc. I had told her to let him know of the rules. I had found out "after" all this that she did not tell him of all the rules, just the rules for during.
WellMadeMale
Posted: Monday, February 24, 2014 8:31:36 PM

Rank: Constant Gardener

Joined: 9/30/2009
Posts: 10,757
Location: Cakeland, United States
lacr0236 wrote:


Ok. Yes my insecurities are fucking with my head and being suspicious has been eating me up, of that I do not deny one bit. However I did not "push" her into the mmf. Believe it or not she brought it up. In hindsight made me wonder if things may have been happening before I was brought in.(yes insecurity) Sorry not previously listed one "ground rule" was I was to know about any texts from him. No I was not looking for transcripts or asking to read them, I wanted to be aware. I was very certain she was hiding texts but I wanted to believe her and with no proof (since it was deleted) I kept giving her the benefit of the doubt. So to me breaking of the rules is cheating, her telling me when I confronted her about the missing texts that she got rid of them since she "knew it would make me mad" to me proved this was a willing intended deception. We have been married 14 yrs, 12 at the time this happened. My wife was the one who set up when we were meeting etc. I had told her to let him know of the rules. I had found out "after" all this that she did not tell him of all the rules, just the rules for during.


My bad, I read it wrong...since your 2nd post actually started out from the actual beginning. You didn't push her into the M/F/M...but you were exceptionally attracted to the female of the other couple were you not? And you never once urged your wife, "Hey I'm game if you are?" because you were wanting to shag 'T' ?

Sorry for my misunderstanding of your otherwise convoluted story.

You made the mistake of NOT being present with the other male or the other couple or whatever the hell it was - when ALL the ground rules were established. It almost sounds like you really didn't have many ground rules.

I feel for ya - but only slightly - because you didn't fully think everything through and now - the mind games are chewing you up.

14 years is a long time to just throw down the drain. Especially if you really do love her and you sense she loves you.

You're the man she's living with right? Maybe you should put the past out of your head and chalk it up to life experience. Don't hold it against her, that kind of thing.

I mean you willingly went along with things 2 yrs ago - eyes open but maybe not quite wide open. Who's fault is that?

Give her a break... give yourself a break.

Give both of you - another chance. What do you have to lose?





Obscenity is the last refuge of an inarticulate motherfucker.
Java
Posted: Monday, February 24, 2014 9:46:12 PM

Rank: Coquette Roguette

Joined: 12/19/2009
Posts: 1,902
Location: the Island of Misfit Toys
lacr0236 wrote:
Long story made short... she said that the talked about doing it but didn't... It has been 2 years now and I still don't completely trust her...



That's pretty much it in a nutshell, isn't it?

She's still to this day denying anything happened a second time with this guy. It's been TWO YEARS! To me it sounds like you're looking for an excuse to hold this against her.

Get over it and move on, or don't and divorce her -- and if you ever have a new girlfriend or remarry, politely decline the the next threesome offer.

The best teacher is past experience. You've learned a lesson.



BabydollSlave
Posted: Wednesday, February 26, 2014 9:26:25 AM

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depends on you and your relationship. i can say no because i couldnt learn to trust my ex again...it was always in my mind. but my trust was never great with him before he cheated on me.
but im currently married to a great guy that i have tremendous trust with. and if he slipped or choose to cheat for whatever reasons i would probably cause i care for him that much.
so i guess in a short story it depends on the relationship. good luck hope things work out for you both

my newest :)
beinggood
Posted: Wednesday, February 26, 2014 11:13:15 PM

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I don't think one ever knows this..depends on the people and if forgiveness is real..seems to me it would be a whole lot of hurt going on...

doing my best to be good..
mentalcase
Posted: Wednesday, February 26, 2014 11:40:54 PM

Rank: Forum Guru

Joined: 11/29/2011
Posts: 383
I don't know if you can trust her again. I don't know if I could. But you guys are married, for better or worse, sickness and in health. But it might help if she does cut contact with this guy. They may be friends, but she is your wife. It's not to be controlling, but so you two can work on your marriage. 14 years is a lot to waste.

If you are willing to give this your best effort, go to couples counselling and work on your communication skills. You two are in love or else you wouldn't be together. But love is based on trust and the trust is broken. You can still fight to save this, but you two need to REALLY work at this!!!
bowhunter5670
Posted: Thursday, February 27, 2014 11:30:57 AM

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Sorry< but she broke the rules and the trust! She showed her real intent when she did not break it off completely when you asked her too. Actions ALWAYS show more than words. I have been thru this myself and know the signs. If she had no intent on seeing him again she would have broke all communication with him. By her not doing so she has hopes of being with him again. Yes you are setting yourself up to be hurt again. If she really loves you and does not want to hurt you again she will stop when you ask her too.My 2 cents
cuddinrick
Posted: Tuesday, March 25, 2014 6:45:59 PM

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Location: Youngstown, United States
lacr0236 wrote:
Long story made short... the wife and I had a mmf. Before hand the ground rules were set up that I had to be present/aware if at any time after they were going get together. And I was to be told of any messages, texts, or calls. I later find out my wife has deleted many texts and set up a rendezvous with him while I was out of town. "She forgot to delete a message to one of her girlfriends" she said that the talked about doing it but didn't. And says that they never did it when I wasn't there... how can I believe her. It has been 2 years now and I still don't completely trust her... Can I really ever trust her again? She says that she is different now and will never risk "us" again, but is still friends with him even though I wanted her to break all contact when I found out. Am I asking to be hurt again?


I don't mean to sound harsh but it sounds to me like you are looking for a reason to be a victim...."Look how she done me dirt"....Or something like that. Look EVERYONE has made a mistake at some time in their lives. Some of us really big mistakes. Some of us have even broken those ridiculous promises that we made (fourteen years ago in your case) to each other. Yes it actually does happen sometimes. That hasn't happened to me (as far as I know) but who cares. I know that my wife loves me and will be there for me. There was one lady when I was younger that cheated (I hate that word (it sounds soooo in high school)) on me and I just KNEW I was justified in the indignation that I felt. We broke up and I got to be right. But that's all I got, and being right isn't really all that satisfying. Working through your shit and coming out the other end together, now that could be satisfying.

Just my take.
Guest
Posted: Tuesday, March 25, 2014 8:10:19 PM

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Joined: 12/1/2006
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I had a friend who was a psychologist and a state appointed hunter of wild animals that left the refuge of the mountains and came into town, or attacked a human or pet in the mountains.

If the wild animal came into town then it had to be killed, not captured and released further away.

He said once the animal lost it's natural fear of man it would return to hunt again.

He equated the same to people that cheated on their spouses.

Once they taste the forbidden they will keep going back unless they do something to change - such as therapy.
His advice was go for the therapy, but do understand both have to go through it together.

The cheater can go to therapy and find a way to not be a cheater.
But the one cheated on, unless they also went through therapy to get rid of their emotions/lack of trust/fears would never be happy again with another person.

Go for the couple therapy at least if it doesn't work out you'll be able to still get back to finding someone else.

I went through the therapy it helped, me a lot, she didn't change, but I left feeling better knowing it wasn't my fault and was able to move on.

Guest
Posted: Tuesday, March 25, 2014 8:13:14 PM

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Joined: 12/1/2006
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I had a friend who was a psychologist and a state appointed hunter of wild animals that left the refuge of the mountains and came into town, or attacked a human or pet in the mountains.

If the wild animal came into town then it had to be killed, not captured and released further away.

He said once the animal lost it's natural fear of man it would return to hunt again.

He equated the same to people that cheated on their spouses.

Once they taste the forbidden they will keep going back unless they do something to change - such as therapy.
His advice was go for the therapy, but do understand both have to go through it together.

The cheater can go to therapy and find a way to not be a cheater.
But the one cheated on, unless they also went through therapy to get rid of their emotions/lack of trust/fears would never be happy again with another person.

Go for the couple therapy at least if it doesn't work out you'll be able to still get back to finding someone else.

I went through the therapy it helped me a lot - she didn't change, but I left feeling better knowing it wasn't my fault and was able to move on.

GunGirlJess
Posted: Tuesday, March 25, 2014 8:51:18 PM

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In my case that would be a no. If I love you, I love you forever until you break my trust and hurt me. I might forgive you, but the part you damaged when you broke my trust can never, ever fully heal. There is no amount of time that can pass, to fix those damaged pieces of our relationship.

petersr
Posted: Tuesday, March 25, 2014 10:09:29 PM

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NO
Dancing_Doll
Posted: Wednesday, March 26, 2014 9:47:59 AM

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Unfortunately this is not an uncommon aftermath of a threesome (I know from personal experience). It's another reason why threesomes are ideal when out of town or on vacation with someone you will never see or meet again. Proximity and familiarity can be tempting and unless the relationship is rock solid (and even then, it can be iffy), there is always the potential for someone to want to hook up again - one on one.

Psychologically it's almost like 'soft-cheating' - it's not like they're meeting someone new and betraying you. It's like a morality-stroker to just think ok - my S.O has already given me permission to fuck this person. I have fucked them already. It's not *that* different. Of course, we all know that it *is* different but that's just the way the mind will compute something when they want to do something wrong and not feel like a total shit about it.

Honestly - it really does depend on the nature of the text messages, but not sure you've seen more than just the one to the girlfriend. She could have backed out of a rendezvous at the last minute out of guilt (but no proof of that other than her word, so who knows) but I guess the point is - why was she entertaining it in the first place, right? I wouldn't be very trusting either. It's a tough spot to be in. At the same time, you sort of let her put her hand in the cookie jar... so the monogamy lines aren't as black and white as a couple that hasn't played like that. I guess it just depends on whether you think the relationship is worth working on. If it's going strong (good sex life, emotional life, connection etc), then give her the benefit of the doubt and give it a chance - but you'll probably want to let her know that cheating is a dealbreaker for you going forward (if it is, everyone is different).


lacr0236
Posted: Wednesday, March 26, 2014 9:32:14 PM

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Thanks again for those who've posted on this... We do talk, and have worked on our relationship. But on the same hand she has never been willing to break off all contact with him. I know it is a bit to ask since there is/was a friendship before. But I would like to think my feelings would weigh in more than a friendship. I guess what is meant by can you truly trust is does the nagging doubts go away? I honestly have tried to trust her. It is just when I hear her on the phone with him (she is not trying to hide/do anything wrong) I still feel my blood pressure go up (not in a good way). I haven't figured out how to make that not happen. I believe it is not as severe as it used to be, but it still causes tension and she can't figure out why I can't "let it go"... Honestly neither can I. She tells me it willm never happen again, I want to believe her. But I can't help looking over my shoulder... will this go away? Yes I am asking questions about my marriage to total strangers, but it kind of helps to just vent. Plus I figured the people on here are less judgmental. Who knows reading this may help someone else not make the same mistakes I did
1LovelyKinkyKitsune
Posted: Friday, March 28, 2014 2:24:49 AM

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lacr0236 wrote:
Thanks again for those who've posted on this... We do talk, and have worked on our relationship. But on the same hand she has never been willing to break off all contact with him. ...I still feel my blood pressure go up...I can't "let it go"... She tells me it willm never happen again, I want to believe her. But I can't help looking over my shoulder... will this go away?


At least you ARE talking about it: here, there, and have with her... that is good! You realise that it IS something that is going to bother you. You cannot let it go because you just do not know and so it is not something "closed" (so to speak) and completely dealt with.

I don't know how you or anyone does it, to stay in a relationship where the trust has been harmed. When you love someone or care, it must be VERY hard. I cannot tell you what to do, but I am having a hard time understanding why she will not do whatever it takes -and end contact with this person, and place your feelings and the marriage first. If she thinks you are asking too much why does she feel that when it causes you such discomfort? Are her feelings more important than yours? I am not one for giving up friends, but this seems no compromise. I would want to KNOW, just like most would, that the marriage comes first. When someone is already feeling insecure now because of something, they need reassurance and to feel safe. Obviously "trust" in a marriage is very important and it seems that this deal invited in feelings of distrust that has shaken things and never left.

Sometimes, depending on the situation, it can be worked through... It has been a long time already. It has had a very negative effect, obviously. You may never get over it or it may take a very long time. Stop beating yourself up for that. From this experience- know yourself, know what is your limits and what is okay and what is not okay. She does not want to "give" any more than she has to gain trust & feels she should not have to or that your feelings are now "your" deal? Then I would recommend counseling and if she will not go, I think you could maybe benefit and be helped but you would also know her willingness level. It's hard to work on a marriage or any relationship when a partner is unwilling, but sometimes we have to deal with things ourselves.

My experience shows me that trust is vital.
I do not know if this qualifies as "cheating" as much as voluntarily allowing in~ but either way- same results affect you. If it were "cheating" - I would not be able to trust, once trust is destroyed, it is hard to get back or it would take a VERY long time or A LOT (maybe more than she is willing to give). Anyone can cheat at any time for any reason and you cannot live your life in fear of that. You are hurting yourself as well. It is not as simple as a decision to "get over it" maybe, it may take some more work - and possibly without her.


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