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The Incest Category is going to be removed Options · View
Dirty_D
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 7:58:24 AM

Rank: Head Nurse
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Posts: 7,481
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ShellyTwizz wrote:
I guess I become the odd egg here. Perhaps I am just sticking my neck on the chopping block for the more silent patrons, but I am for lack of better wording, distraught by this action. Ok, I can understand that site admin/moderators are tired of explaining the differences/stance between the category and the use in other areas. And I can understand that some people don't like the category or topic. But first off if you don't like the topic or category, then don't access it or read those stories - isn't that what the little tags at the bottom of the stories is for? And second, and please understand I am not trying to bash on anyone, just expressing an opinion, if you are tired of explaining the differences - either stop being a mod (that is a duty isn't it, to help understand the site better?) or just say "because the site says so". I read through many of the posts, and there was one that makes mention of "steps" and "in-laws" - good point, would stories such as those be considered banned stories? Mine for example does not specifically reference any one type of person, but could easily be an incest-oriented letter between family members, just as simply as it could be between two same-sex married people (which by the way is frowned upon by a large majority of the world also - anything same sex in fact). Now I understand or gather that the site itself is not founded or based or whatever in the United States - therefor there really isn't the freedom of expression issues. And its a free site which is provided and maintained by folks in essence out of the kindness of their heart (thank you by the way). But as I started this post out with - I guess I become the odd egg - I don't agree with the decision - but life will go on with or without the category. Just feel bad that the authors will now have to rework their stories if they want to keep them up. I guess im just confused if it is being removed because it was offensive or because it was too much effort? Why not just stop accepting those kinds of stories? And maybe put a disclaimer on the tab or something that would still allow the stories to be there but not as easily accessible?


While I understand that some people really like to read these, and wrote many a story in this genre, it's really in the sites best interests to move forward. If you take a look at this genre you will find that it contains by far more of the less quality work. There are a few well written ones, but by and large it attracted more of the people who just threw a bunch of words on paper. Worse yet, these are the writers most likely to mod bash when the verifiers are trying to help.

Lastly, OMKN pointed that many were thinly veiled exploitation tales. These stories were carefully vetted to prevent "true tales" from making the front page. However, I can tell you from my days as a verifier, that some of the ones that never made the front actively caused me great distress. There are tales that all of the mods have come across from time to time that haunt you. Not veiled and very abusive. We, as a community, neither want nor need that element here.

I have stood up in the discussion re incest in the past and stated I understood the taboo aspect of the fantasy. But I welcome the higher class of writing that the removal of this topic will promote. I had my own incest story, and it has now been reworked. For many of the stories posted here, a simple change from siblings to best friends, from uncle to teacher, will enable the author to keep those stories.


Thank you Nicola for working as always to make this site the great place to post my work. I echo what has been posted here already, I look forward to this change and the opportunities it provides!
adele
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 8:00:12 AM

Rank: Forum Guru

Joined: 4/8/2011
Posts: 21,370
Location: if I knew where I was then I would not be here...
I am also really glad to see this category gone, and hope that it will once and for all stop all the '' well we can write about it, why can't we talk about it?" arguments. I am also going for the omnium badge and this category had me perplexed as to what I could write. THANK YOU Nicola!!

Be sure to read my new series - Angela
https://www.lushstories.com/stories/voyeur/angela-gets-a-new-job-1.aspx
https://www.lushstories.com/stories/masturbation/angela-gets-a-master-part-2-of-the.aspx
https://www.lushstories.com/stories/anal/angela-gets-her-first-butt-plug-part.aspx My 1st Famous Story
and the latest part...https://www.lushstories.com/stories/anal/angela-gets-settled-into-her-new-place.aspx

and view some of my other recent offerings... https://www.lushstories.com/stories/cheating/the-cheater.aspx
https://www.lushstories.com/stories/milf/a-new-life-for-rose.aspx
please read and vote for my Competition Story... https://www.lushstories.com/stories/love-stories/the-ice-hotel.aspx
Dirty_D
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 8:00:18 AM

Rank: Head Nurse
Moderator

Joined: 4/15/2011
Posts: 7,481
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Driver1963 wrote:
I know the category is a pain in the backside for a whole host of different reasons and I can see why it is being let go. That said, I will miss it greatly. It has been a favorite category of mine and I am sure of many others too. I wish I knew where else to go.


Try a different category. a good place to start is the Recomended Read list, you might find a whole different area that peaks your interest. I know my preferences have changed in the years I've been here.

book
RumpleForeskin
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 8:01:15 AM

Rank: The Right Rev of Lush

Joined: 7/3/2009
Posts: 2,921
Location: Lost in the ozone somewhere east of Luckenbach Tx,
Driver, as someone mentioned earlier, *removed by admin* has an incest category. However, the minimum age is 18.

I've deleted my brother/sister incest stories but just hidden my lesbian tale with two cousins pending some definition.

glasses8

Writing is not necessarily something to be ashamed of, but do it in private and wash your hands afterwords. - ROBERT HEINLEIN

Feels So Right, It Can't Be WrongMore steamy, seductive, straight step-sibling sex, 2-3

FROM:
Becky -- FOR: Matt -- With Love:
a Festive contest winner – honest

HOW HUMANS DO IT: a fish-eye view of sex an Editor's Pick - no kidding
Katje
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 8:02:21 AM

Rank: Story Verifier
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Joined: 2/17/2013
Posts: 1,697
Location: KC metro, United States
RejectReality wrote:

You're going to have to create a clear definition of what's incest and add it to the guidelines. The line for in-law and step(relation) will need to be drawn, because people will assume that those are okay if you don't. "No Incest" doesn't mean the same thing to all people


This.

I have a series involving grown step-siblings. I'm all for the banning of incest, as it's not just the familial relation, but rather the ease of sliding into pedophilia and snide underage references. But, a clear line should be drawn somewhere so those of us with "taboo" stories know whether to keep them here, or move them elsewhere.

A few of my Recommended Reads:

(Simply click on any of the images to read my stories!)
Wilful
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 8:13:23 AM

Rank: Devil's Advocate
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Joined: 6/15/2013
Posts: 1,198
Location: Digging a hole on the beach, Australia
I don't necessarily agree with the decision, but I do respect it. Nicola's leadership on this issue should be supported one hundred percent. I sincerely hope the site doesn't suffer for it.

Please check out my latest story, Kibeho
BraveBitch
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 8:23:21 AM

Rank: Forum Guru

Joined: 10/16/2012
Posts: 239
Location: New York, United States
Most of my stories are written under the 'Incest' category because I felt that people like to read them more.
Well anyways, my questions is when you will delete/hide the stories then will I loose my badges of 'famous story' Millionaires club' and 'Author 50' ?






Liz
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 8:30:14 AM

Rank: Scarlet Seductress
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Joined: 1/22/2013
Posts: 5,501
Location: In the sweet shop, United Kingdom
BraveBitch wrote:
Most of my stories are written under the 'Incest' category because I felt that people like to read them more.
Well anyways, my questions is when you will delete/hide the stories then will I loose my badges of 'famous story' Millionaires club' and 'Author 50' ?


No stories will be 'deleted', you will still have access to them on your story list. They will not be visible to anyone else on the site though.

As for the badges, I suspect that will be the case, yes.


Coco
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 8:31:19 AM

Rank: Lady of Mystery
Moderator

Joined: 7/22/2011
Posts: 4,694
Location: Fantasy City, United States
BraveBitch wrote:
Most of my stories are written under the 'Incest' category because I felt that people like to read them more.
Well anyways, my questions is when you will delete/hide the stories then will I loose my badges of 'famous story' Millionaires club' and 'Author 50' ?


More than likely, yes you will. Badges are generated on the populating of their subject matter. Any badges that use those stories to make up that badge will be affected. However, I am not certain that those badges can be grandfathered in or even if they should be.

Please remember that this is not a decision that was made lightly, it has been thought about for a great deal of time. We encourage all authors to take a stab at different categories, expand their audience base by kicking ass in a new category.




Guest
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 8:42:25 AM

Rank: Lurker

Joined: 12/1/2006
Posts: 652,869
Okay, so I've written some incest stories here, but honestly I only wrote most of them as a challenge to myself since I'd never written about it before. As y'all can see though I write in mostly all the categories. It's gonna be sad to see 25 of my stories go, but it only challenges me expand my writing even further. I'm on board 100% with this, Nicola. thumbright
Guest
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 8:47:07 AM

Rank: Lurker

Joined: 12/1/2006
Posts: 652,869
I understand why this is happening and I am ok with it.

But fuck, this really messes up a current series of mine. If I can't rework it I will have to scrap it.

Edit: I will have to delete ch1.5 but it can be reworked.

lunaswift
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 8:48:14 AM

Rank: Rookie Scribe

Joined: 3/6/2014
Posts: 2
Location: United Kingdom
Am glad to see the back of it. It was the one category that I had no interest in producing for or reading. Makes the site more inviting too.

See all my stories and get free sample chapters at lunaswift.com
BraveBitch
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 8:48:40 AM

Rank: Forum Guru

Joined: 10/16/2012
Posts: 239
Location: New York, United States
I just hope that I don't loose my badges because I have earned them as a writer. Now that LUSH is removing incest stories, it shouldn't affect what I have earned here. I have earned those badges because of the people who read my stories. If LUSH has taken a decision of removing this category then it's totally fine, but I would be really disappointed if I loose my achievements here.






Guest
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 8:50:40 AM

Rank: Lurker

Joined: 12/1/2006
Posts: 652,869
BraveBitch wrote:
I just hope that I don't loose my badges because I have earned them as a writer. Now that LUSH is removing incest stories, it shouldn't affect what I have earned here. I have earned those badges because of the people who read my stories. If LUSH has taken a decision of removing this category then it's totally fine, but I would be really disappointed if I loose my achievements here.

this is a concern of mine as well.

It's only 1 badge but my famous story is something I am very proud of
Dani
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 8:55:19 AM

Rank: Big-Haired Bitch
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Joined: 12/25/2010
Posts: 5,624
Location: Under Your Bed, United States
Milik_Redman wrote:
I see this as long in coming and very welcome. Erotica should be beautiful and fulfilling. It should enrich our lives and make us feel good about who we are. Though I have two such stories, I don't mind at all rewriting them into something I can be proud to share.

This is a bold and clear statement that Lush continues on it's quest to provide the highest standards of quality and class in the erotic arts.


I couldn't have said it better myself.




CurlyGirly
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 8:58:07 AM

Rank: CurlyFries

Joined: 10/5/2012
Posts: 1,826
Location: United States
Coco wrote:


More than likely, yes you will. Badges are generated on the populating of their subject matter. Any badges that use those stories to make up that badge will be affected. However, I am not certain that those badges can be grandfathered in or even if they should be.

Please remember that this is not a decision that was made lightly, it has been thought about for a great deal of time. We encourage all authors to take a stab at different categories, expand their audience base by kicking ass in a new category.


Not that this affects me, but I thought I would throw it out there.

If someone has a famous or even legendary badge for an I-train story and they rework it and put it in another category, isn't it possible that those badges will remain? Reworking it won't change views, scores, and comments will it?





It won a potato. Aren't you intrigued?



Coco
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 9:02:41 AM

Rank: Lady of Mystery
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Joined: 7/22/2011
Posts: 4,694
Location: Fantasy City, United States
CurlyGirly wrote:


Not that this affects me, but I thought I would throw it out there.

If someone has a famous or even legendary badge for an I-train story and they rework it and put it in another category, isn't it possible that those badges will remain? Reworking it won't change views, scores, and comments will it?



I've reworked a story of mine and it remains unaffected. It should be the same if the story is edited and adjusted on site. If a story is reworked and submitted as new, then there will be a problem.




Guest
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 9:03:43 AM

Rank: Lurker

Joined: 12/1/2006
Posts: 652,869
No way mine can be redone. It's way to deep in that category.

I don't want my badge taken away but if it happens it happens.
Guest
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 9:05:19 AM

Rank: Lurker

Joined: 12/1/2006
Posts: 652,869
I am sad to see them go. I only liked reading the incest stories that explored the journey the characters took from family members to lovers. I could not stand the poorly written, which consited of, "hay I want to fuck you" (and then sex). For me it was the character transition and the build up to the sex that turned me on. Again, said to see them go. crybaby
DanielleX
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 9:10:42 AM

Rank: Blonde Bombshell
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Joined: 11/6/2011
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For those seeking clarification and/or wishing to muddy the waters. Incest is sex between ANY family members or relationships where, through marriage, a person becomes another's parent or guardian. That means it includes cousins and step children.

I know first cousin relationships are not illegal in some countries, but for purposes of clarity, they are included here.

If there are any nuances or anomalous relationships, then I am sure these will be dealt with by the Moderating Team on a case basis.

Removing the category still leaves a wealth of naughtiness, which is what Lush is really about!

Danielle x


Guest
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 9:14:04 AM

Rank: Lurker

Joined: 12/1/2006
Posts: 652,869
Glad to see it go. Good call.
TXtabber
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 9:14:36 AM

Rank: Advanced Wordsmith

Joined: 11/19/2010
Posts: 71
Location: Hot Town, United States
I'm okay with it. I had written a series but then pulled it. I only brought it back because of the many requests. I have saved my stories so I might try and rework them. Lush is a wonderful place allowing us to express ourselves and I'll support their decision.

Alphamagus
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 9:17:45 AM

Rank: Forum Guru

Joined: 9/19/2011
Posts: 169
Location: Camberley, United Kingdom
Personally, The very thought of incest on any level sickens me to the very core of my soul. It is the very worst form of abuse in the main and lush will be made a much better site without it.
Guest
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 9:18:23 AM

Rank: Lurker

Joined: 12/1/2006
Posts: 652,869
Hmmmmm, as one who strongly believes in freedom of speech and the rights of adults to have safe, sane and consensual sex no matter who their 'partner may be', and the rights of private enterprise to manage their business the way they see fit I've reached an impasse.

The first stories I published on here was 'Girly', it had a different name when I first published it under T T Velvet many, many years ago. I started writing lesbian stories because of my best friend's (a lesbian) request for such stories. I got a following that didn't know I was a man, and I got fan mail from women wanting to meet me for sex. I stopped the writings because I thought of myself as a fraud. My style of writing is feminine - even one of the verifiers thought I was a woman until she read my profile. Not necessarily by choice, but I do identify with women more than I do men. Hell, I use to want my daughter to be a lesbian so she wouldn't have to put up with some the asshole men out there (yes, I know there are asshole lesbians too :-)

I understand the problems some have with 'incest' and I don't disagree with them, especially if they were 'victims' of incest. My soon to be ex was such a victim and it has taken a terrible toll on her life (although she refuses to do anything but blame others and not get help). Forced sex on the vulnerable is wrong no matter what way you look at it.

As we all know there are those who still consider BDSM, sex between the same sex, let alone marriage to be illegal, immoral etc. Yet, those stories are published here as long as it is not with anyone under 16.

I was contacted, here on Lush by those that wanted me to explore a sexual relationship with my underaged daughter. The first one I blocked and deleted. The next ones I politely affirmed my stories are written for entertainment by those who enjoy such. Before you ask if I would have sex with my daughter if she was an adult I'll tell you I don't really know. I do know that I would never groom my daughter at any age to have sex with me. If she were to ever entertain the idea of her and I having sex it would have to come from her.

I was and will be again a Daddy/Little - I enjoy that role and responsibility because I like taking care of girls. Buying them nice things. I enjoy the play of spanking etc. All safe, sane and consensual - I don't believe in harming anyone.

Incest between consenting adults is legal in many countries and two US States. I'd like to suggest that since you have another site http://www.storiesspace.com (at least I think it belongs to the Lush Owners-if not it's a damn good clone) you put up a site or sites that will handle Incest, BDSM, and whatever else and keep Lush Vanilla. That way people can pick what they want to read and to know they're not being considered some type of pervert by other readers and have to be careful what they write or say on the forums.

Just as you have a softcore and hardcore posting of photos which I do not understand at all - this is a site about nudity and sex and whether the female/male organs are displayed overtly or covertly shouldn't make any difference at all. If you don't like your sex photos or otherwise anything but vanilla, or with just a little chocolate sauce on the side then don't play the forum games. I don't like in your face hardcore porn photos or stories so I don't engage in those areas - I am puzzled why some of my photos were removed because the young woman's labia was visible from the rear - but was classified with the wide gapping holes of oozing cum on the porn forum.

Then you have those who don't like the idea of sex between older men and younger women, but encourage the Cougars to go for it. Duhhhhhhh! Why the double standard? Why? Because men are still seen as the aggressor and the female the vulnerable one. GOD don’t get me started on feminism of which I have been a victim in a very horrible way.

I appreciate that Lush owners and mods and verifiers have a difficult time pleasing everyone, but if you open a site to sex then it will never be all vanilla. However, like any good ice cream parlor there are tubs of all the different flavors available for all the different taste. I use to own an ice cream parlor and several times I forgot to dip the scooper in the water bath and had the customer refused to take the flavor because it had another flavor touching it. Live and learn.

You've got a good site here it's the only one that I've stayed this long on - almost a year now. Met and enjoyed the banter back and forth with several of those here. It'll be sad to go but it won't hold me back if I do decide to go. I'll wait until the waves settle before I make a decision. I've for sure liked being able to hone my prose writing skill, but there are other sites available for that as well.

Good luck to all of you head honchos no matter what you decide.thumbright
Magical_felix
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 9:25:24 AM

Rank: Wild at Heart

Joined: 4/3/2010
Posts: 5,162
Location: California
MadMartigan wrote:


What sprite said.

If they are of the daddy/dom variety, they are ok as is.

However, if you truly believe and have seen profiles with incest overtones, please message a senior LUSH mod about your concerns.


What about the heavy pedophilia overtones with daddy dom/little girl thing?

...

I think the incest stories are gross, creepy and, like others have said, incest is a product of rape and abuse.

That said, I have always thought the incest category was a "necessary evil" to a successful erotica site. The backbone category almost. I am not someone that knows every single erotica site out there but the only ones that I have seen that have a lot of traffic have a lot of incest stories. It's impossible to tell without a lot of work if readers of incest eventually trickle into other categories. I can see a great reduction of new readers eventually. I've always thought that incest is so prevalent in erotic writing because it's easier to convey with words than it is with film or pictures.

It's creepy as fuck though and I'm glad it's gone but I hope that a new flow of readers keeps coming to the site despite the incest category being gone.





Poppet
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 9:33:59 AM

Rank: Sweetest Cricket

Joined: 10/5/2012
Posts: 5,457
Location: You Inspire Me, United States
Okay, I have four stories in this genre. I have never been a big fan of it, but I have written in it. I'm with a few other's who are a bit miffed about possibly losing their famous badges. Two of the four of mine are famous stories. Losing the views on those stories is also going to put a big dent in my chances at getting to Millionaire’s Club. Now, this isn't going to stop me from writing, but it is a bit of a bummer.

My question is, just to clarify: If I hide my four stories from public view, can I (if I am able to) reword it and edit it and submit as is. (Just changing the genre, before resubmitting) Or do I have to start completely over? With this, I'd not lose my views/scores/comments?

I just want to make it clear, because I am a little confused.

Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ You Inspire Me Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ
NorthWest52
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 9:40:36 AM

Rank: Rookie Scribe

Joined: 12/23/2013
Posts: 2
Location: United Kingdom
If you want the site to expand and attract lots more people then it's a really good decision. Lush has a lot of class compared to other sites, and this category did let it down. A line has to be drawn somewhere. Great decision.
Dirty_D
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 9:43:51 AM

Rank: Head Nurse
Moderator

Joined: 4/15/2011
Posts: 7,481
Location: Soaking up the sun, United States
Poppet wrote:
Okay, I have four stories in this genre. I have never been a big fan of it, but I have written in it. I'm with a few other's who are a bit miffed about possibly losing their famous badges. Two of the four of mine are famous stories. Losing the views on those stories is also going to put a big dent in my chances at getting to Millionaire’s Club. Now, this isn't going to stop me from writing, but it is a bit of a bummer.

My question is, just to clarify: If I hide my four stories from public view, can I (if I am able to) reword it and edit it and submit as is. (Just changing the genre, before resubmitting) Or do I have to start completely over? With this, I'd not lose my views/scores/comments?

I just want to make it clear, because I am a little confused.


yes you can hide/rework and you *shouldn't* lose your badge/votes.
RejectReality
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 9:44:47 AM

Rank: Forum Guru

Joined: 1/29/2012
Posts: 148
Location: Alternate Reality, United States
DanielleX wrote:
For those seeking clarification and/or wishing to muddy the waters. Incest is sex between ANY family members or relationships where, through marriage, a person becomes another's parent or guardian. That means it includes cousins and step children.

I know first cousin relationships are not illegal in some countries, but for purposes of clarity, they are included here.


On the surface, this should seem clear. Blood relatives - banned. Step-children - banned.

If you don't want to reject a ton of them, you need to expand on that to include step-siblings. I'm assuming that's the case, as leaving a fuzzy line where step-siblings from a trophy wife relationship are okay but those who grew up together are not is asking for controversy.

Of course, that creates its own problem when someone asks, "How are step-siblings from a new marriage any different than in-laws?"

This is going to be an issue for a while, and the more carefully you define the new rule at the outset, the less argument you're going to have, and the shorter the duration.

You have to consider that you're suggesting to rework stories, and the logical thing that pops into anyone's head, in order to maintain the taboo level, is to "water it down" as little as possible by going with one of these options.

I'm not trying to be argumentative for my sake. I'm going to let all mine go without reworking them, and I'm going to assume the most draconian version of the rule when deciding which stories to post here. I have other outlets for those, so it's not an issue to me.

I've just been in this game for a long time, and I know what's about to hit the fan. I'm trying to help y'all build some protective walls to keep some of the splatter off ya ;)

Poppet
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 9:47:11 AM

Rank: Sweetest Cricket

Joined: 10/5/2012
Posts: 5,457
Location: You Inspire Me, United States
naughtynurse wrote:


yes you can


Well, if that is the case. I'm not sure what the big deal is over the loss of incest, if we will still have the views/scores/comments. Thanks for answering.

Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ You Inspire Me Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ
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