Welcome Guest Search | Active Topics | Members | Log In | Register

The Incest Category is going to be removed Options · View
pj2012
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 5:14:09 PM

Rank: Forum Guru

Joined: 12/28/2012
Posts: 437
Location: Canada
Sounds like censorship to me. Whether I choose to read or write stories of that genre, as long as there is no reference to underage participants, should be my choice to make. If you don't like them, don't go to that section of the site. The choice should be up to the individual member.
Reading those stories or writing them does not (or should not) label the reader or author as 'perverted or unsavoury' any more than reading about group sex or any other category. The stories are fictional and as such do not reflect any actions by any real people.
SanchoHardbottle
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 5:16:47 PM

Rank: Active Ink Slinger

Joined: 10/13/2007
Posts: 38
Location: United States
Fantasies don't destroy families _candy_. That's what we're talking about. FANTASIES. The stories on this site never hurt anyone. And if you are going to try and say that this category of story was somehow encouraging immoral behavior I ask you to explain why the same can't be said of any of story on this site in any other category. I don't know about you but I'm able to watch and enjoy lethal weapon without thinking its good idea for cops to go around shooting people.
Jasmine_x
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 5:19:08 PM

Rank: Forum Guru

Joined: 12/10/2012
Posts: 300
Location: Wakefield, United Kingdom
I don't know what I'm more pissed off about, the fact that Nicola was very sly about this deletion and only acknowledged it like 11 hours before it happened or the fact that it's months of my own free time down the drain for nothing. 28 stories of mine have been taken down due to this, I'm sorry but I agree with Sancho. It's like a middle finger to the face.

SanchoHardbottle
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 5:22:09 PM

Rank: Active Ink Slinger

Joined: 10/13/2007
Posts: 38
Location: United States
VanGogh wrote:


hey, SH .... we are ALL a little perverted here on Lush! Don't take it so hard or personally.

I believe that this move/change that Nicola wants is a class act and stops the whining about why the incest fantasies are allowed but no other discussions allowed.

Quite frankly .... many many authors here have not had to resort to incest to garner "famous story" badges. And, I would think now, Taboo will become popular .....

or maybe there will be a Workplace/Office Sex category open up!! bunny


I didn't "resort" to anything VH. I wrote stories I wanted to write. People just happened to like them. Give it time. At this rate Taboo will be gone next.
Guest
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 5:22:18 PM

Rank: Lurker

Joined: 12/1/2006
Posts: 816,696
sexybbw71 wrote:


I agree that incest in real life destroys people's lives but this is supposed to be fantasy!!! As long as it stays in fantasy I see nothing wrong with it as long as all participants are consenting adults!!! There is a huge difference between fantasy and reality!!


Thank you for pointing out that there is a difference between fantasy and reality.

Destructive themes like rape, cheating, and other hardcore themes appeal to many. I'm intelligent enough to know that people are turned on by many different types of things, and many of them are not pleasant or appealing to all. I appreciate the fantasy element, but obviously there's an issue otherwise this thread wouldn't even be here.

The incestuous "fantasies" posted here are written by adults but not always about adults. I have seen stories about teens. I'm not going to split hairs about it, but perhaps you haven't known anyone who has been through this. I haven't personally experienced it, but I am close to several who have, and I can't look past the reality to "appreciate" the taboo thrill of it.

pj2012
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 5:22:41 PM

Rank: Forum Guru

Joined: 12/28/2012
Posts: 437
Location: Canada
Change I can accept. Unilateral censorship I cannot.
Mazza
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 5:23:09 PM

Rank: Mazztastic

Joined: 9/20/2012
Posts: 3,351
Location: Scotland, United Kingdom
sexybbw71 wrote:


They are as good as deleted if no one else but the writer can see them!


I think I am right in saying that they have been removed from general view, but the authors themselves still have access them in order that they can save them, edit them or whatever - it gives the writers the opportunity to change and remove unsuitable content and pass it back to the moderating to team to have it re-verified, in order as not to lose one's votes, comments and any other associated merits.

Whilst I am suppose that not all stories may be retrievable, I would guess that a good majority will be, with a little work, not just on the part of the author, but also the moderating team. There are other sites who will accept such submissions pretty much as they stand and be glad of the addition, if authors wish to have them published as they stand now.

Hopefully, those who wish to keep their stories on the site will work in conjunction with Lush to get their stories back up, in their new form, as quickly as possible and with as little fuss as possible.

Whilst the news of the deletion of the category does come as a surprise (pleasant to some, not so to others) it is simply the way of things. I don't think that the category can really be compared to any other. Some people will vote with their feet, others will stay - that's way it goes.

As others have said, Lush really is the best erotic stories site around and I'm sure that those who wish to remain a part of it will be pleased to watch it grow and evolve. We may not all like these changes, but it seems that the decision has been made and we will simply have to adapt.

What we do have is a great community with some really excellent stories, forums et al - the gap left by the category removal will soon be filled with new stories.

EDIT: As to censorship - Lush has chosen (IMHO, wisely) to remove this category - it's worth pointing out that there were already many subjects which were and are unacceptable for publication, e.g. underage, snuff, scat, blood, murder, bestiality etc - it's all in the submission guidelines. As a contributor to the site, you do agree to abide by Lush's guidelines as they are set out. These are prone to change, it happens, as it has today.



Nothing to see here...
seeker4
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 5:24:32 PM

Rank: Forum Guru

Joined: 10/17/2012
Posts: 5,746
Location: Canada
pj2012 wrote:
Sounds like censorship to me.


Most fiction mags turn down more stories than they accept and some of those are because of unacceptable content. Are they censoring?

Libraries generally don't buy anything too explicit (though I notice that the current erotic romance boom has changed that to some extent). Are they censoring?

Most blogging sites have rules on what is allowed, often excluding some or all sexual content. Are they censoring?

Perhaps. But we generally don't use that term in these cases. We call it selection. We call it setting standards for how that "site" will use its resources.

Nicola is within her rights to set whatever standards she wants for HER website. This is not a publicly run and funded site where there is some constitutional onus to accept everything. It is a privately run site that can, and should, set whatever standards it feels necessary.

It may be censorship by some definitions but I do not think it is. It is SELECTION. It is setting standards for what you will "buy" (or allow on the site, in this case, since it isn't a paying market). No one is stopping the authors from publishing incest somewhere else.

You have a right to write whatever you like. That's free speech. You have the right to post it on a public sites that allow it. That's free speech. You do not, however, have a right to publish in a specific market. That is subject to the standards set by that market.




An obsession with fur, a beautiful older woman, a steamy first time.

Soft as Fur She Was ** Lush Fetish Stories Competition Runner Up **

I've been mentoring a new Lush author, sallytheslut2. Here's her first story about a young woman discovering her sexuality with an older man.

The Man That Turned Me into a Slut


RejectReality
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 5:26:00 PM

Rank: Forum Guru

Joined: 1/29/2012
Posts: 213
Location: Alternate Reality, United States
There's not much sense in arguing against the decision at this point. The category has been removed, and every story in it has been rejected. Getting up in arms about it and sparring with other posters is only going to get the thread locked, leaving nowhere to voice concerns and ask questions.

There are still a lot of fine points that need clarification, and the people who read/write these stories are probably the only ones who are going to think of them. A majority of the moderation team has made it clear that these stories creep them out, so they're not going to think of these things. If this thread gets locked before those things are brought up, they're not going to be in consideration when the final guidelines are written.

Step, in-law, relatives sharing someone but not engaging each other, role-play... Just a few areas that need to be addressed in the guidelines above and beyond "pure" incest stories.

sexymomma51
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 5:27:59 PM

Rank: Rookie Scribe

Joined: 6/4/2012
Posts: 4
sexybbw71 wrote:

I agree that incest in real life destroys people's lives but this is supposed to be fantasy!!! As long as it stays in fantasy I see nothing wrong with it as long as all participants are consenting adults!!! There is a huge difference between fantasy and reality!!

This. I always enjoyed the stories for what they were: dirty, fictional erotica.

I can totally understand why the story verifiers and mods are happy to see it go, though.
hornypussy90
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 5:30:50 PM

Rank: Rookie Scribe

Joined: 7/25/2013
Posts: 3
Location: wisconsin, United States
I'm sorry some people are offended . But that doesn't mean everyone is . U should b able to read any topic on this site. If u don't like it u can go somewhere else. Thats one of my favorite categories
SanchoHardbottle
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 5:32:02 PM

Rank: Active Ink Slinger

Joined: 10/13/2007
Posts: 38
Location: United States
What was the point of this discussion board ? It's seems to me as though the decision to remove the category and the stories in it was a foregone conclusion. This was nothing but a chance to get enough people to say how happy they were with it to make it seem justified.
VanGogh
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 5:32:42 PM

Rank: Sarcastic Coffee Aficionado

Joined: 2/10/2012
Posts: 3,952
Location: Vancouver, Canada
Cheers, Nic!

To a Classy Erotica Story Website .... Lushstories.com

Guest
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 5:32:54 PM

Rank: Lurker

Joined: 12/1/2006
Posts: 816,696
_Candy_ wrote:


Thank you for pointing out that there is a difference between fantasy and reality.

Destructive themes like rape, cheating, and other hardcore themes appeal to many. I'm intelligent enough to know that people are turned on by many different types of things, and many of them are not pleasant or appealing to all. I appreciate the fantasy element, but obviously there's an issue otherwise this thread wouldn't even be here.

The incestuous "fantasies" posted here are written by adults but not always about adults. I have seen stories about teens. I'm not going to split hairs about it, but perhaps you haven't known anyone who has been through this. I haven't personally experienced it, but I am close to several who have, and I can't look past the reality to "appreciate" the taboo thrill of it.



Well then if that is your criteria then why don't we take the cheating and cuckold genre down as well. My late husband was devastated by 2 ex wives that cheated on him! If a person doesn't know the difference between fantasy and reality then I feel bad for them. Many of the categories that are on Lush, if done in real life, would deeply hurt people! That is not a good enough reason to single out one category and not the others!
Guest
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 5:34:23 PM

Rank: Lurker

Joined: 12/1/2006
Posts: 816,696
SanchoHardbottle wrote:
Fantasies don't destroy families _candy_. That's what we're talking about. FANTASIES. The stories on this site never hurt anyone. And if you are going to try and say that this category of story was somehow encouraging immoral behavior I ask you to explain why the same can't be said of any of story on this site in any other category. I don't know about you but I'm able to watch and enjoy lethal weapon without thinking its good idea for cops to go around shooting people.



As I stated before, I appreciate the idea of fantasy because otherwise I wouldn't even be on lush. I personally can't look past the reality to "appreciate" the taboo thrill of it. I find it different than other fantasies and I think a lot more people lined up to see Lethal Weapon than anyone would to see a movie about incest.


TheScheherezadeFeint
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 5:36:52 PM

Rank: Story Verifier

Joined: 9/26/2013
Posts: 1,005
Location: Pretending to be the ghost in your attic, United S
While I've never had any problem with other people's fantasies, it was never mine, and I would be thrilled to not have it flung in my face all the time. I agree with Nicola (and the rest of the Lush administration) most about one thing, which is it is extremely trying to have to tell everybody to shut the hell up about it when they're talking to me. A casual mention was never a big deal (though never a turn-on) but making a new friend who immediately wants to tell you about how they supposedly got their sex lives started by their [insert family member here] just pissed me off. It's kind of gross and insensitive in much the same way that certain other fantasies too far outside the general like scat fantasies aren't for everybody, and shouldn't be tossed around like they are.

Once again, it's not a judgment, but when it's something that for the bulk of people is a turn off, it's hard to justify allowing the imagery on a site when it leaks out of its section so constantly and severely. Anyway, I'm sure I've offended some people, but I hope they take it the way I mean it, which is to say that there are plenty of places on the internet for you to work on that as a fantasy, but it's too specialized an interest for a general site like this one. Just my first thoughts when I read Nicola's original post.

Recommended Reads by TheScheherezadeFeint:
Undeniable - Erotic Poem
Disappearing Act - Love Poem
Synthetic Hours - Fantasy/Sci-fi - Eighth Place, 'Some Like It Hot' competition, January 2015
Night Work - Erotic Poem
Eating Breakfast In Glass Slippers - Straight Sex - Fifth Place, 'The Morning After The Night Before' competition, November 2014
Miracle of Night - Love Poem
The Brightest Black You've Ever Seen - Love Story - Ninth place, 'Toy With Me' competition, September 2014
Scream Fire - Erotic Poem - Audio read by MadameMolly
At First Sight (He) - Quickie Sex
Liz
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 5:38:08 PM

Rank: Scarlet Seductress
Moderator

Joined: 1/22/2013
Posts: 7,223
Location: In the sweet shop, United Kingdom
SanchoHardbottle wrote:
What was the point of this discussion board ? It's seems to me as though the decision to remove the category and the stories in it was a foregone conclusion. This was nothing but a chance to get enough people to say how happy they were with it to make it seem justified.


It was an announcement, not a discussion.



SanchoHardbottle
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 5:38:28 PM

Rank: Active Ink Slinger

Joined: 10/13/2007
Posts: 38
Location: United States
_Candy_ wrote:



As I stated before, I appreciate the idea of fantasy because otherwise I wouldn't even be on lush. I personally can't look past the reality to "appreciate" the taboo thrill of it. I find it different than other fantasies and I think a lot more people lined up to see Lethal Weapon than anyone would to see a movie about incest.




And they don't have to line up to read these stories, and neither do you. but those that want to on this site should be able to.
HeraTeleia
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 5:40:31 PM

Rank: Top Shot

Joined: 1/25/2014
Posts: 1,768
Location: Canada
Given the number of PM's I receive asking to RP incest "fantasies", I don't think this category can be deleted soon enough. Incest is incest is incest, fantasy or no. For all the whiners, grow the fuck up and find something else to write about.

Want to learn a new word? No dictionary at hand? Read "My Favourite Word", a Recommended Read: http://www.lushstories.com/stories/flash-erotica/my-favourite-word.aspx

Want it all? Masturbation, exhibitionism, seduction, and of course, sex? Read "Tension", a Recommended Read: http://www.lushstories.com/stories/straight-sex/tension-1.aspx

Want a quick read? Like surprises? Read "Double Oxer", a Recommended Read: https://www.lushstories.com/stories/flash-erotica/double-oxer.aspx



Guest
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 5:41:33 PM

Rank: Lurker

Joined: 12/1/2006
Posts: 816,696
TheScheherezadeFeint wrote:
While I've never had any problem with other people's fantasies, it was never mine, and I would be thrilled to not have it flung in my face all the time. I agree with Nicola (and the rest of the Lush administration) most about one thing, which is it is extremely trying to have to tell everybody to shut the hell up about it when they're talking to me. A casual mention was never a big deal (though never a turn-on) but making a new friend who immediately wants to tell you about how they supposedly got their sex lives started by their [insert family member here] just pissed me off. It's kind of gross and insensitive in much the same way that certain other fantasies too far outside the general like scat fantasies aren't for everybody, and shouldn't be tossed around like they are.

Once again, it's not a judgment, but when it's something that for the bulk of people is a turn off, it's hard to justify allowing the imagery on a site when it leaks out of its section so constantly and severely. Anyway, I'm sure I've offended some people, but I hope they take it the way I mean it, which is to say that there are plenty of places on the internet for you to work on that as a fantasy, but it's too specialized an interest for a general site like this one. Just my first thoughts when I read Nicola's original post.


Hmmm...if the bulk of people were offended by incest then why was that category the most popular? It was a turn of for you and the administration but it is obvious from the number of views the stories got that "the bulk of people" found them highly erotic. My story "A Mother's Job" earned me a famous story badge in a little over a week!
Guest
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 5:42:27 PM

Rank: Lurker

Joined: 12/1/2006
Posts: 816,696
Whilst I accept the decision, and understand the reasoning behind it, I am a little perplexed that stories containing violence, and mental and physical cruelty are still acceptable.

Many stories in the Cuckold category, unlike the Wife Lovers category, involve humiliation of the husband, where it is quite clear, that far from loving her husband as she states, the wife actually despises him. The claim in some of these stories that the husband welcomes his changed situation is often belied by the storyline where he is forced against his will to accept his wife's adultery, and his humiliation.

Equally it is clear to me that some of the violence in BDSM stories is sufficient to cause permanent damage and disfigurement to the body, and is no different from wife beating, which classes as grievous bodily harm in the UK and is punishable by a significant jail sentence. The collusion of the recipient in the sado-masochistic relationship does not excuse the violence, and should not be condoned, no more than we condone those who get their sexual pleasure from snuff movies. The essential element in all these kinds of stories is the lack of real mutuality and consent.

However, that is just my view, and I merely refrain from reading such stories.

An apology to the mods from me - I have reworked a taboo story to remove its reference to incest, even though it was not taken offline, and I have edited one of my incest stories to hopefully make it acceptable. I have also edited a story for a friend to replace Dad by stepdad, where there is no actual blood relationship, which is I believe, the description of incest. I do not know whether she will resubmit the story, or whether it will be acceptable, since she still continues to call him Dad, as is often the case with step children who have never known their birth father.
SanchoHardbottle
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 5:42:32 PM

Rank: Active Ink Slinger

Joined: 10/13/2007
Posts: 38
Location: United States
HeraTeleia wrote:
Given the number of PM's I receive asking to RP incest "fantasies", I don't think this category can be deleted soon enough. Incest is incest is incest, fantasy or no. For all the whiners, grow the fuck up and find something else to write about.


Classy. a very inviting attitude, I applaud your willingness to talk this out with those that disagree with you.
Jasmine_x
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 5:46:23 PM

Rank: Forum Guru

Joined: 12/10/2012
Posts: 300
Location: Wakefield, United Kingdom
HeraTeleia wrote:
Given the number of PM's I receive asking to RP incest "fantasies", I don't think this category can be deleted soon enough. Incest is incest is incest, fantasy or no. For all the whiners, grow the fuck up and find something else to write about.


Grow the fuck up? I dislike everything to do with BDSM, that is thrown in my face on the daily. Do I throw a wobbly? No, I just state that it isn't my cup of tea and move on with my life. I also have no problem writing about other subjects but when you've put a large amount of time into something with no reward at the end of it, then you'll understand why a lot of the incest authors are pissed off with this change.

Guest
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 5:47:01 PM

Rank: Lurker

Joined: 12/1/2006
Posts: 816,696
SanchoHardbottle wrote:


And they don't have to line up to read these stories, and neither do you. but those that want to on this site should be able to.


I personally chose not to read them. I know that they were incredibly popular and I never understood it. Those that operate this site are able to do as they please. If everyone is in such an uproar, go develop an incest site and knock your lights out.
Liz
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 5:47:15 PM

Rank: Scarlet Seductress
Moderator

Joined: 1/22/2013
Posts: 7,223
Location: In the sweet shop, United Kingdom
Notice: Please remain respectful to each other - everyone is entitled to an opinion.



missbonniepark34
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 5:52:07 PM

Rank: Rookie Scribe

Joined: 4/8/2014
Posts: 1
Location: 54156, United States
I understthoughtthoughb of people are offended by thought of the incest stories, but if you honestly think about it we don't know if their team stories or just stories themselves.
MLogan
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 5:56:26 PM

Rank: Active Ink Slinger

Joined: 10/16/2012
Posts: 29
Location: dublin, Ireland
Not talking So much for freedom of speech or expression
robdabaker
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 6:07:27 PM

Rank: Active Ink Slinger

Joined: 4/16/2012
Posts: 22
Location: United States
HeraTeleia wrote:
Given the number of PM's I receive asking to RP incest "fantasies", I don't think this category can be deleted soon enough. Incest is incest is incest, fantasy or no. For all the whiners, grow the fuck up and find something else to write about.


Wow! Way to be a fair and open minded moderator. Glad to know the people making decisions on this site can be so understanding... oh wait. How dare you. you are volunteering your time to create an environment for everyone. Not just yourself. Your blatant disregard for others opinions is sad. Based on your argument the same can be said about teacher fantasies. thats a subject that MANY others find wrong. the courts even find teacher relationships to be illegal. but those stories are still allowed. many of the complaints people have is that there are relationships between adults and teens in incest. but the teacher student relationship is adult to teen. but thats okay i guess. in every incest story i've read the characters have all been over the minimum age Lush dictated. if thats an issue make it higher. no teen issue anymore and thats a hell of a lot easier for writers to rework. your grossed out by the content to bad. i'm grossed out by BDSM and Gangbang doesn't mean i have the right to ask the site to take that down. i just keep away from that freakin content.
Mysteria27
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 6:10:03 PM

Rank: Prolific Writer

Joined: 4/3/2013
Posts: 8,281
Location: Seducing your mind in the, United States
There are lots of other sites that will take your stories as is. Just do a little investigating. I've already have two of mine up on other sites.

Some of our stories just aren't fixable so just put them somewhere else. What can you do.

Move on and just write in other categories.

Wilful
Posted: Saturday, April 19, 2014 6:12:05 PM

Rank: Devil's Advocate
Moderator

Joined: 6/15/2013
Posts: 1,455
Location: Digging a hole on the beach, Australia
As I've said before, I respect the decision. It's Nicola's site and she can do what she wants with it.

Keep in mind that one of the things she needs to do is protect the mental wellbeing of the mods who volunteer their time to verify stories. I can only imagine how some of the content that's submitted, that we never see, could be incredibly traumatic to some people. Having trained as a telephone counsellor, I can tell you that's no small thing.

What I find disappointing however, is the judgement, implied or otherwise, from many of the above posts that those who have an interest in the category are somehow less than. Art, literature, erotica is about the expression of ideas. And a medium such as this should be a safe place for people to explore their fantasies, whatever they might be, without fear of shame or condemnation.

I welcome support of the decision and respect the opinions behind them. However, I find the value judgements downright offensive.

Regardless, I've got a stepdaughter story I posted in the BDSM category, so I'll PM Gav to take it down consistent with the spirit of the decision. And I await further guidance from Nicola before making any decisions of my own to resubmit.

Please take a look at my latest story, Banging for Roof.

And for a sexy little rush of Adrenalin, pick yourself up a copy of the Lush Summer anthology.
Users browsing this topic
Guest 


Forum Jump
You cannot post new topics in this forum.
You cannot reply to topics in this forum.
You cannot delete your posts in this forum.
You cannot edit your posts in this forum.
You cannot create polls in this forum.
You cannot vote in polls in this forum.

Main Forum RSS : RSS

Powered by Yet Another Forum.net version 1.9.1.6 (NET v4.0) - 11/14/2007
Copyright © 2003-2006 Yet Another Forum.net. All rights reserved.