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Can Romney/Ryan get elected? Options · View
Ruthie
Posted: Tuesday, September 11, 2012 6:30:45 PM

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1ball wrote:


That's what we need, but that's not what sells to our dumbshit voters. Between being economically naive and sorely lacking in critical thinking skills, the majority of voters are only useful for cancelling each other's votes. There's no real incentive for the parties to change their winning strategies. It's easier for them to play blame games.


Marzipan, 1ball, marzipan. Try to stay on topic.

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Guest
Posted: Tuesday, September 11, 2012 8:25:21 PM

Rank: Lurker

Joined: 12/1/2006
Posts: 883,389
I didn't read all of the posts although I should have. My thoughts are that there is really not a good choice. Maybe if Ross Perot were 20 years younger and had a running mate that still had his whits? I don't know? My gut feeling is the worst is yet to come for most of us?
Thinkingaboutit
Posted: Tuesday, September 11, 2012 8:27:57 PM

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Joined: 1/23/2009
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Location: North Texas, United States
lafayettemister wrote:
Can Romney/Paul win the election? Yes. Will it happen? Probably not.

First off, all this talk about the Reps being full of chicanery and flip flopping and pandering, manipulative, appealing to Americans' fears, blah blah blah... is silly. By default it's saying that the Dems don't do the same things. BOTH sides do that. To suggest that one side has clean(er) political hands is naive. Just as the Reps use fear to tell their base that Liberals want to take all their money and guns and turn the country into a total nanny state. The Dems use fear to tell their base that conservatives are going to rape you and force you to have a baby you'd rather abort, take away your birth control, and let the rich off live off the sweat of the real working middle class. The average person on either side of the political spectrum believes the "other" side is dirty.

The fact of the matter is, the U.S. is split nearly 50/50 in the political sense. On each side, half are fully and totally left or right and nothing will ever convince them to change sides. But the other half of each group is probably closer to the middle and can be moved to either side depending on the election and issues at hand and can exist happily either way. But no matter who wins, a good quarter the country is going to feel left out and disenfranchised and feel they have no voice while living in a society that is the 180degree opposite of how life and governement should be, in their minds.

The problem with labeling all republican/conservative voters as racist, bigoted, stupid, white male, civil rights denying people is problematic for the Dems. First of all it invalidates the entire political opinion of millions of people. It's easier to say their opinions are invalid because of racism or bigotry, thus unworthy of debate or discussion than it is to face those issues head on and see that possibly there is some credibility to their voice on other matters, such as economic and fiscal responsibilities. Most republicans I know vote republican 90% on matters of fiscal and economy than they do social issues. Second of all, for a Republican to "switch" sides to vote Democrat he has to look himself in the mirror and decide that the views of the Republican party are wrong. Thus agreeing that Reps are racist, bigoted, stupid, white, male, civil rights denying people... which means that he himself is all those things. People do not and are not going to view themselves that way, they'll dig in the heels even deeper. Very few will look in the mirror and actually see a racist or bigoted person, and most AREN'T racist and bigoted. It is impossible to sway a person's thought process after labeling him, he won't hear anything after whatever term you use to describe him. Contrary to popular belief, there are black, hispanic, asian, homosexual, and female Republican/conservatives.

I agree and disagree with parts of what MNP said. Depending on which side of the aisle you sit, both parties have become masters of taking away personal freedoms. He is right that Americans still believe that the news anchors are telling us the truth. The fact that the term "mainstream media" even exists proves that there is little objective and unbiased reporting. Anyone outside of the "mainstream" is viewed with skepticism and lack of credibility. It always baffles me the way FoxNews watchers bash msnbc/cnn for being in the pocket of democrats while ignoring the obvious right-leaning stances on their preferred news source. And vice versa.

Politics has become more like X-Factor. That's John McCain's fault for throwing Sarah Palin on the stage and parading her around like Miss America. Both sides are throwing up their heavyweights at conventions, preaching to the choir while bashing the other side. The two party system is broken. No matter who wins, millions of Americans will feel unimportant. Neither candidate is very appealing to me. Either one in office will try to mold our country to fit their vision of it. Doing only what is best for them and their party instead of doing what is right for us as a whole, even if parts of that are contrary to their own personal beliefs.

Pres. W. Bush took a "you're with us or you're against us" approach to the world as a whole and in part with his politics. Pres. Obama has a similar mindset. Both sides have jumped all over that ideal to try to force feed their ways onto the opposition instead of working together to find ways to coexist and compromise and keep our country somewhere in the middle. This "all or nothing" approach is going to doom us, one way or the other.

Can Romney win? Yes. Likely? No.

Sorry for being so long winded.


Very well said sir
beowulf69
Posted: Tuesday, September 11, 2012 8:29:53 PM

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Joined: 10/24/2011
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Location: Cocoa Beach, United States
The presidential race is too close to call right now. Romney and Obama are in a dead heat and there are a lot of undecided voters. It's a pick your poison election.

My first story for Lush is posted, The Goodbye Fuck.
http://www.lushstories.com/stories/straight-sex/the-goodbye-fuck.aspx
ByronLord
Posted: Tuesday, September 11, 2012 9:58:52 PM

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lafayettemister wrote:
Can Romney/Paul win the election? Yes. Will it happen? Probably not.

First off, all this talk about the Reps being full of chicanery and flip flopping and pandering, manipulative, appealing to Americans' fears, blah blah blah... is silly. By default it's saying that the Dems don't do the same things. BOTH sides do that. To suggest that one side has clean(er) political hands is naive.


No, both sides are not the same, that is a trope used by lazy people to avoid thinking. Obama is President and has therefore had to pass three budgets and propose a fourth. We have a VERY good idea what he is going to do and which difficult choices he is prepared to take.

Hint: you cannot cut taxes, increase spending and balance the budget, it does not work. Didn't work for Ronnie, didn't work for either Bush and won't work if Romney tries it. The unfunded Bush tax cut is the reason the surplus left by Clinton turned into a deficit.

Romney on the other hand is promising to give himself a huge tax cut (he thinks 13% too much it appears) and increase military spending and somehow balance the budget. Thing is that his numbers simply don't work unless the 'tax loopholes' he is talking about eliminating are mortgage interest relief and the charitable deduction. There just aren't enough tax breaks to fund his tax cuts and balance the budget, let alone pay for the spending increases he proposes.

Given that the US has just ended one war and should be planning to leave Afghanistan soon, military spending should be decreasing, not increasing. Unless that is Romney plans to start another war.

Romney has been running for President longer than Obama has been President yet he does not have a detailed plan on any part of his program. He is going to get schooled in the debates and lose quite badly.

Now I actually have some personal experience of a Romney company, Bain Consulting which he was CEO of at the time. They consulted us all right, 'consult' being a combination of con and insult. The advice we got was total ass-lickery that made no sense at all but made the execs feel good till they lost their jobs a few years later for following the stupid Bain advice. They also gave us some processes that were useless and they charged several millions for the privilege.

Romney was very good at consulting because he could make money telling people what they wanted to hear all the time. It was lousy advice but very profitable for Romney. I think a Romney presidency would go the same way.

ByronLord
Posted: Tuesday, September 11, 2012 10:11:08 PM

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LadyX wrote:
I predict it swings largely on the happenings in the first presidential debate, but if I had to predict now, I'd say Romney wins on the strength of Florida, and again that state's results will be clouded by controversy.


Romney has only two ways of winning. He has to win Ohio and most of the swing states or if he loses Ohio he has to win every one of the swing states.

They have already pulled their ads from Wisconsin and Pennsylvania.

Obama is currently polling ahead in all the swing states except NC and has been doing so since May. They are running scared (as they should) but it is very hard to see how Romney could win given his current strategy.

The GOP is definitely attempting voter suppression tactics but they have already backfired a few times. They have already lost the court cases in Ohio and Texas and look set to lose most of the others. In the meantime Dems have been signing up voters for postal ballots so that they can't be denied the vote because of eight hour queues like Ken Blackwell engineered in 2004.

Guest
Posted: Tuesday, September 11, 2012 10:26:58 PM

Rank: Lurker

Joined: 12/1/2006
Posts: 883,389
principessa wrote:


Please everyone, don`t hope. If you are not registered to vote, go get it done. If you have time, get to work for the campaign as a volunteer. If you can afford it, contribute even just $10. Make sure that your friends, family and colleagues are registered and vote. That is what you can do. Participate to the extent that you can.




Just so you know, I am registering to vote this year. I have my vote and I'm entitled to my hopes, it lifts my spirits.
Guest
Posted: Tuesday, September 11, 2012 10:31:36 PM

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Joined: 12/1/2006
Posts: 883,389
Byron, there are actually more combinations that give Romney the win than there are for Obama. Obama is still enjoying the convention bounce but we all know bounces go up and then usually go back down. IF you look historically, Carter led Reagan by 4% at this time in the campaign, and Dukakis led Bush 41 by 17% and we know how those leads turned out.

Voter suppression? How exactly is requiring a person to actually be a citizen to be able to vote suppression unless you are in favor of non-citizens voting? Currently in places like Texas, you can register to vote and actually vote without having to prove you are a citizen. In fact it is illegal here for them to ask for any form of ID at all. When you have counties where there are consistently more votes than citizens there is obviously something wrong. On the other hand, please explain why the Obama has not seen that the Defense Department has enacted the law he signed into law to enable the military to vote. Last election only something like 17% of the military was allowed to vote because they could not get ballots in time or could not get them back in within the time limits. BY law, there were to be offices open on military bases, foreign and domestic, to improve the voting process but that has not been done by the federal government. We even have the Justice Department suing several states who are trying to make considerations to allow our service men and women to vote.

If you need a picture ID to buy cigarettes, buy liquor, board an airplane, and thousands of other things, how does it supress votes to require one to vote? Especially when most attempts have included details such as free ID cards, mobile units that will come to your home if you want to get one, and other such provisions for those who claim it is a hardship to get an ID.
LadyX
Posted: Tuesday, September 11, 2012 10:37:25 PM

Rank: Artistic Tart

Joined: 9/25/2009
Posts: 4,771
There's no substantial evidence of voter fraud of any kind, so why is it all the sudden an issue now? Because they're in danger of losing a national election, and want to keep poor people from voting. It's logical on Republicans' parts, and it's politics as usual, but let's call it what it is, not some bullshit faux-magnanimous quest for authentic voting results.
jollylolly
Posted: Wednesday, September 12, 2012 5:40:03 AM

Rank: Forum Guru

Joined: 6/24/2012
Posts: 732
A lot of Americans I know are sick and tired of that Muslim Socialist from Kenya and his hatred of fetuses and small business owners. So yes, I think Romney's election is very possible! crybaby
lafayettemister
Posted: Wednesday, September 12, 2012 7:11:25 AM

Rank: Forum Guru

Joined: 10/4/2010
Posts: 6,694
Location: Alabama, United States
ByronLord wrote:


No, both sides are not the same, that is a trope used by lazy people to avoid thinking. Obama is President and has therefore had to pass three budgets and propose a fourth. We have a VERY good idea what he is going to do and which difficult choices he is prepared to take.

Hint: you cannot cut taxes, increase spending and balance the budget, it does not work. Didn't work for Ronnie, didn't work for either Bush and won't work if Romney tries it. The unfunded Bush tax cut is the reason the surplus left by Clinton turned into a deficit.

Romney on the other hand is promising to give himself a huge tax cut (he thinks 13% too much it appears) and increase military spending and somehow balance the budget. Thing is that his numbers simply don't work unless the 'tax loopholes' he is talking about eliminating are mortgage interest relief and the charitable deduction. There just aren't enough tax breaks to fund his tax cuts and balance the budget, let alone pay for the spending increases he proposes.

Given that the US has just ended one war and should be planning to leave Afghanistan soon, military spending should be decreasing, not increasing. Unless that is Romney plans to start another war.

Romney has been running for President longer than Obama has been President yet he does not have a detailed plan on any part of his program. He is going to get schooled in the debates and lose quite badly.

Now I actually have some personal experience of a Romney company, Bain Consulting which he was CEO of at the time. They consulted us all right, 'consult' being a combination of con and insult. The advice we got was total ass-lickery that made no sense at all but made the execs feel good till they lost their jobs a few years later for following the stupid Bain advice. They also gave us some processes that were useless and they charged several millions for the privilege.

Romney was very good at consulting because he could make money telling people what they wanted to hear all the time. It was lousy advice but very profitable for Romney. I think a Romney presidency would go the same way.


All the things you say about platforms and ideals may be true. But still, both sides are prone to lying and trickery. To suggest that one side is playing clean and fair while the other side is pure dirty and evil is naive. BOTH sides are dirty and evil. It's not laziness. I don't believe all Dems are altruistic worldly do-gooders while all Republicans are evil minding capitalist pigs.





When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the loser. Socrates
LadyX
Posted: Wednesday, September 12, 2012 7:35:58 AM

Rank: Artistic Tart

Joined: 9/25/2009
Posts: 4,771
jollylolly wrote:
A lot of Americans I know are sick and tired of that Muslim Socialist from Kenya and his hatred of fetuses and small business owners. So yes, I think Romney's election is very possible! crybaby


I know, right? I mean, Obama can say what he wants to say, but how often can he get away with burning effigies of unborn children, laughing as he robs good and decent wealthy people of their hard earned capital over the sobbing protests of their families, and, worst of all, suggest that birth control should be covered under insurance plans that already cover it(!) before 'we, the people' are compelled to elect a good and decent steward of all that (according to zombie traditionalists) is simple, good, and decent?

The mad reign of the worst ruler since Pol Pot must end now. Unless you want death panels! Then don't say we didn't warn you. Grover Norquist and Michelle Bachmann await your sanity's return.

1ball
Posted: Wednesday, September 12, 2012 7:48:31 AM

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Posts: 970
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ByronLord wrote:
Hint: you cannot cut taxes, increase spending and balance the budget, it does not work.


When investor confidence is as badly damaged as Obama has made it, you cannot raise taxes, increase spending, balance the budget or improve the economy. If Obama gets another four years, two more Congresses, either Republican or Democrat will happily keep spending. Nothing will be done to reduce the debt. It will become much bigger and a much greater percentage of the GDP. This boom of the economic cycle that Obama has flattened will be over and the next president will have that much more difficulty taking us through the next trough. More damage will be done to the economic opportunities of the poorest members of the society and they will emerge more dependent on government and more firmly in the pockets of their Democrat massas.

And all because so many people believe that neither the greed they feel for the feeling they get when they act sanctimoniously nor the greed they feel for the perceived surplus of others' money is greed.


My latest story is too hot to publish. My most recent story before that is Even Stranger In Lust
Ruthie
Posted: Wednesday, September 12, 2012 10:32:37 AM

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JillMom wrote:


If you need a picture ID to buy cigarettes, buy liquor, board an airplane, and thousands of other things, how does it supress votes to require one to vote?


Voting is a constitutional right. Please don't compare it to buying cigarettes, liquor, or boarding airplanes. Those things aren't rights protected by the U. S. Constitution.

http://








WellMadeMale
Posted: Wednesday, September 12, 2012 11:42:36 AM

Rank: Constant Gardener

Joined: 9/30/2009
Posts: 11,199
Location: Cakeland
Investor confidence? LMFAO

Yeah, it was Obama and the Democrats who created the Great Recession. Pretty much killing investor confidence as we knew it in the 80s and 90s.

Fucking revisionists & pre-alzenheimers is afflicting you people, isn't it?



Did this fucking crook ever find out what caused the collapse of one of the most powerful economies during his 8 years in office? No. His solution was to push this fiasco (like those two wars) off on the next poor bastard to take the White House.

And you people expect 8 years of thievery and malfeasance to be fixed in 4 years time.

You fuckers must've flunked basic arithmetic too. No wonder Romney/Ryan appeal to you.

Let's go back to the Bush GOP/Republican economic policies which produced such a fantastic and dependable stock market, booming economy and balanced budgets.

fucktards

Obscenity is the last refuge of an inarticulate motherfucker.
Guest
Posted: Wednesday, September 12, 2012 11:49:59 AM

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Joined: 12/1/2006
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Everyone should vote! and vote often!
sprite
Posted: Wednesday, September 12, 2012 11:53:03 AM

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jollylolly wrote:
A lot of Americans I know are sick and tired of that Muslim Socialist from Kenya and his hatred of fetuses and small business owners. So yes, I think Romney's election is very possible! crybaby


this is sarcasm, right? cause i really can't take you seriously when you say stuff like this. it's just all sorts of wrong, factually, for starters. hatred of fetuses... yeah... *puts on best Charlton Heston voice* Take your stinking paws off me, you damned dirty fetus!


LadyX
Posted: Wednesday, September 12, 2012 11:55:15 AM

Rank: Artistic Tart

Joined: 9/25/2009
Posts: 4,771
sprite wrote:


this is sarcasm, right? cause i really can't take you seriously when you say stuff like this. it's just all sorts of wrong, factually, for starters. hatred of fetuses... yeah... *puts on best Charlton Heston voice* Take your stinking paws off me, you damned dirty fetus!


She's a sane person, I'm sure it was sarcasm. Well played, too. LOL
sprite
Posted: Wednesday, September 12, 2012 11:55:30 AM

Rank: Her Royal Spriteness
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*packs up stuff and moves to Canada after reading posts, watching Fox news, and meditating on the possibility of Romney winning*


sprite
Posted: Wednesday, September 12, 2012 11:56:55 AM

Rank: Her Royal Spriteness
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Joined: 6/18/2010
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LadyX wrote:


She's a sane person, I'm sure it was sarcasm. Well played, too. LOL


*breathes a sigh of relief* i hoped so, but it's all too real for me to not take it at face value these days - i HEAR that kind of stuff at the Grocery store, i mean! *sighs*


LadyX
Posted: Wednesday, September 12, 2012 11:57:59 AM

Rank: Artistic Tart

Joined: 9/25/2009
Posts: 4,771
sprite wrote:
*packs up stuff and moves to Canada after reading posts, watching Fox news, and meditating on the possibility of Romney winning*


Canada, eh?

Hoser.



I'm moving to Jamaica! High of 88, low of 78, every damn day. Irie, mon.

sprite
Posted: Wednesday, September 12, 2012 12:00:10 PM

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LadyX wrote:


Canada, eh?

Hoser.



I'm moving to Jamaica! High of 88, low of 78, every damn day. Irie, mon.



you're just moving for the weed, don't lie to me! can i come visit? drunken


LadyX
Posted: Wednesday, September 12, 2012 12:01:35 PM

Rank: Artistic Tart

Joined: 9/25/2009
Posts: 4,771
sprite wrote:


you're just moving for the weed
, don't lie to me! can i come visit? drunken



And the men! And....I've already said too much. hiding


LOL yes. Come on down, supergirl!


sprite
Posted: Wednesday, September 12, 2012 12:04:23 PM

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LadyX wrote:



And the men! And....I've already said too much. hiding


LOL yes. Come on down, supergirl!




*packs up my bong, my bikini, and a pair of sunglasses* on my way, baby! Party time!


WellMadeMale
Posted: Wednesday, September 12, 2012 12:09:47 PM

Rank: Constant Gardener

Joined: 9/30/2009
Posts: 11,199
Location: Cakeland
you're way over packed already... you won't need that bikini.

Obscenity is the last refuge of an inarticulate motherfucker.
principessa
Posted: Wednesday, September 12, 2012 12:12:42 PM

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NightFox wrote:




Just so you know, I am registering to vote this year. I have my vote and I'm entitled to my hopes, it lifts my spirits.


Oh. please hope as well. I just want everyone to vote, too.

Dirty_D
Posted: Wednesday, September 12, 2012 12:16:39 PM

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So, I am one of those independent voters. I had truly hoped Obama could help things, but the truth is he has failed. However, I don't think Romney would make anything better. So my dilemma is this: do I vote with my head, against Obama? Or with my heart in support of a 3rd party candidate, knowing that it amounts to a vote for Obama? Knowing that he has attempted to push through some pretty anti farming pieces of legislature?

I honestly don't know. I'll update you when I make up my mind.


sprite
Posted: Wednesday, September 12, 2012 12:19:56 PM

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naughtynurse wrote:
So, I am one of those independent voters. I had truly hoped Obama could help things, but the truth is he has failed. However, I don't think Romney would make anything better. So my dilemma is this: do I vote with my head, against Obama? Or with my heart in support of a 3rd party candidate, knowing that it amounts to a vote for Obama? Knowing that he has attempted to push through some pretty anti farming pieces of legislature?

I honestly don't know. I'll update you when I make up my mind.


vote who YOU want to win. that's what i do - if enough people vote independent, maybe next time, others will take heart and do it and maybe not soon, but eventrually, we'll have a viable third or fourth or even fifth party - change happens slowly, but it does happen.


Dirty_D
Posted: Wednesday, September 12, 2012 12:31:02 PM

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sprite wrote:


vote who YOU want to win. that's what i do - if enough people vote independent, maybe next time, others will take heart and do it and maybe not soon, but eventrually, we'll have a viable third or fourth or even fifth party - change happens slowly, but it does happen.


It's what I've done in the past :)

Seriously, neither political party suits me. I don't like the fiscal policies of one party, highly dislike the social policies of the other.


principessa
Posted: Wednesday, September 12, 2012 12:34:12 PM

Rank: Sophisticate
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naughtynurse wrote:


It's what I've done in the past :)

Seriously, neither political party suits me. I don't like the fiscal policies of one party, highly dislike the social policies of the other.


Sorry to disagree with Sprite, but if you live in a state that is a swing state, you have to vote strategically, even if you hold your nose while doing it, or you will help your worst option to win. Unforunately, the Electoral College system is winner take all, state by state. In a parliamentary system, my take would be different.

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