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What do women want? We dont want the bad guy, we just want someone who isnt this!! Options · View
Guest
Posted: Wednesday, October 6, 2010 8:27:38 PM

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This is the flip side of the women's book "Why Men Love Bitches: From Doormat to Dreamgirl-A Woman's Guide to Holding Her Own in a Relationship" by Sherry Argov.

It appears that both genders, if perceived as being "nice" are doormats and losers.

I say ... fuck that ... be yourself. Treat others as you would like to be treated ~ and that right person will come along and share your life. Be a Dickhead or a Bitch to someone ... you'll be alone in life (unless you've got a shit load of money!)

Van
Dancing_Doll
Posted: Wednesday, October 6, 2010 8:37:16 PM

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OK, let's all pause for a moment so that everyone can step away from their computer and go take their blood pressure medication.

When everyone has stabilized, it might be worthwhile to look up the definitions of "irony" and "satire", which will help you to understand the nature of this article. Uhmm... I thought it should be obvious to "most" people that you're not supposed to take the website "Heartless Bitches International" as a literal translation.

Sense of humour anyone? Fail!





Guest
Posted: Wednesday, October 6, 2010 9:10:07 PM

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This is humor, in the Relationship Advice area?

Sorry, I'm not buying it.
DamonX
Posted: Wednesday, October 6, 2010 10:08:31 PM

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Joined: 1/25/2009
Posts: 798


Quote:
Let me see if I follow some of this crazy logic.

If I disagree about a topic, then that topic is all about me?



Quote:
Let me see if I follow some of this crazy logic.

If I disagree about a topic, then that topic is all about me?


Not always...but since you rarely utter anything other than a brief and abrupt retort, I can see how others could mistake your defensive and somewhat hostile response as an indication that you somehow perceive yourself being one of those so-called "nice guys."

But...maybe not. Maybe you just have a soft spot for those insecure types? Or a dislike of women that actually speak the truth?

If the best thing something can say about you is that you are "nice", then you probably don't have a lot going for you.

And Bassman... just because a guy is not the pathetic pushover type that the writer mentions in the article, doesn't make him a "macho asshole." Think of it as a continuum, not black and white. There seems to be a happy medium that most women seem to be attracted to.

The article author is simply stating characteristics that she finds unatractive in men. And her views are very very common (outside the emotionally idealistic internet fantasy world that is). Instead of condemning her for speaking her mind, you should actually listen to what she has to say.

Or go on condemning her as a heartless bitch and completely ignore the point of her little article...

Quote:
This is humor, in the Relationship Advice area?


Yes Rocco, humour can actually be be combined with every other subject. I've actually found your defensive rantings to be to be quite humorous. icon_smile
DamonX
Posted: Wednesday, October 6, 2010 10:23:48 PM

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DamonX
Posted: Wednesday, October 6, 2010 10:25:06 PM

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Joined: 1/25/2009
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Guest
Posted: Thursday, October 7, 2010 4:18:13 AM

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Posts: 779,511
Oh right ... now it's just satire, humor, and we're supposed to just say "hahaha" and move on.
Sorry, I'm not buying it, it's a cop-out.

Damon, I suppose your posts are just satire as well? I'm not buying that either, I rather think that the "cartoons" you posted show what you and DD really believe. You say things about it not being all black and white, and to see things as a continuum, then you post these. Your actions speak way louder than your words.

DD, you can stand behind your "nice guy" posts all you want, but you have nothing to teach me or anyone else here on this.

Sense of respect, anyone? Fail.

If trashing and slandering people because they don't act like self-centered, macho assholes (yes, I'm intentionally using that term again) is the only way some of you can get your rocks off, then you're almost worth feeling sorry for.

Not only am I not missing anything, I'm counting my blessings.

Guest
Posted: Thursday, October 7, 2010 9:58:02 AM

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I think the problem we have here is a quibbling over terminology, as I believe it has been noted several times the term 'nice guy' desperately needs to be revised to include the words 'needy', 'controling' and 'desperate'.

Try to think of this as more of a guide of unattractive male characteristics and, as for the pop-psychology being employed by the author, take it as such but be assured that people actually think that way. Scary huh.

It's amazing how quickly this thread turned into a shitfight. Nice work everyone, I love it when we all let our inner children out to play with eachother....lucky I've got bandaids in my purse....

However, Ms Monroe, hilarious article, many thanks for posting it!

XX
BB
DamonX
Posted: Thursday, October 7, 2010 6:06:10 PM

Rank: Forum Guru

Joined: 1/25/2009
Posts: 798
bassman199 wrote:
Oh right ... now it's just satire, humor, and we're supposed to just say "hahaha" and move on.
Sorry, I'm not buying it, it's a cop-out.

Damon, I suppose your posts are just satire as well? I'm not buying that either, I rather think that the "cartoons" you posted show what you and DD really believe. You say things about it not being all black and white, and to see things as a continuum, then you post these. Your actions speak way louder than your words.

DD, you can stand behind your "nice guy" posts all you want, but you have nothing to teach me or anyone else here on this.

Sense of respect, anyone? Fail.

If trashing and slandering people because they don't act like self-centered, macho assholes (yes, I'm intentionally using that term again) is the only way some of you can get your rocks off, then you're almost worth feeling sorry for.

Not only am I not missing anything, I'm counting my blessings.



Actually Bassman...I "get my rocks off" by getting irrational responses like this from people like you. icon_smile

So you say that you know what we "really believe"? Well enlighten us then, so we are all on the same page.

If you think that the only two types of men that exist are "macho assholes" and the kind of guys in the article, then you are farther removed from reality than I thought. (Unless you exist in a high school, romantic comedy movie).

In that case, I'd probably be giving you a wedgie and stealing your lunch money huh?
happy1

I hate to harp on the same old issue, but the article is not condemning men for being "nice." It is addressing out a subgroup of men, pointing out the flaws in their approach when it comes to women, and labelling them as "nice guys."

Now, I realize that some of you guys are absent from the social scene and such are not quite privy to the accepted terminology...but the term "nice guy" is pretty damn common when describing these types. It is a generalization, grouping men together based on a set of common characteristics. Similar to how you would use the term "macho asshole" when describing all the other males that actually have sex with women. icon_smile

Oh...and next time...use the BOLD red font. It will be so much more dramatic. That blue is much too calm and soothing...

Instead of existing in the imaginary world you've created, maybe you should actually evaluate how well your current philosphy has worked for you and make adjustments accordingly.

Or keep on slamming others as heartless bitches and macho assholes while you wait for Mrs. Right to magically appear. (Psst...I hear she likes nice guys Shhh )
Guest
Posted: Thursday, October 7, 2010 7:27:44 PM

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Joined: 12/1/2006
Posts: 779,511
Betty-Bea wrote:
I think the problem we have here is a quibbling over terminology, as I believe it has been noted several times the term 'nice guy' desperately needs to be revised to include the words 'needy', 'controling' and 'desperate'.

Try to think of this as more of a guide of unattractive male characteristics and, as for the pop-psychology being employed by the author, take it as such but be assured that people actually think that way. Scary huh.

It's amazing how quickly this thread turned into a shitfight. Nice work everyone, I love it when we all let our inner children out to play with eachother....lucky I've got bandaids in my purse....

However, Ms Monroe, hilarious article, many thanks for posting it!

XX
BB


so true .... wanna chuckle over a glass of wine later? I think a few could use one or two or MANY!!

Van

Guest
Posted: Thursday, October 7, 2010 9:45:24 PM

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Joined: 12/1/2006
Posts: 779,511
VanGogh wrote:
Betty-Bea wrote:
I think the problem we have here is a quibbling over terminology, as I believe it has been noted several times the term 'nice guy' desperately needs to be revised to include the words 'needy', 'controling' and 'desperate'.

Try to think of this as more of a guide of unattractive male characteristics and, as for the pop-psychology being employed by the author, take it as such but be assured that people actually think that way. Scary huh.

It's amazing how quickly this thread turned into a shitfight. Nice work everyone, I love it when we all let our inner children out to play with eachother....lucky I've got bandaids in my purse....

However, Ms Monroe, hilarious article, many thanks for posting it!

XX
BB


so true .... wanna chuckle over a glass of wine later? I think a few could use one or two or MANY!!

Van



Hells yes...I'll bring the chips and dip :p
WellMadeMale
Posted: Thursday, October 7, 2010 10:12:57 PM

Rank: Constant Gardener

Joined: 9/30/2009
Posts: 10,758
Location: Cakeland, United States
Betty-Bea wrote:
It's amazing how quickly this thread turned into a shitfight. Nice work everyone, I love it when we all let our inner children out to play with eachother....lucky I've got bandaids in my purse....

However, Ms Monroe, hilarious article, many thanks for posting it!

XX
BB


I like the way you type/talk, Betty. This thread has been hilarious. My thanks to you too, MM.

Incidentally, all my friends are nice guys and nice gals, and they are much nicer than me. Why they choose to be my friends, I have no idea. But I'm thankful for them.

I won't spend time around pricks or bitches. Heartless Gold diggers can be fun, though!

Obscenity is the last refuge of an inarticulate motherfucker.
Guest
Posted: Saturday, October 9, 2010 10:47:32 AM

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Damon, you could have perhaps read carefully what I wrote before responding totally irrationally, to use your own term ...

If I'm not mistaken, I wrote:
I rather think that the "cartoons" you posted show what you and DD really believe.
Where you got the impression that I said I actually know what you believe is a mystery to me.
Also, I never used the term "macho assholes" to describe ALL the other males that actually have sex with women.

You don't know Jack Shit about me or my life, what I think, what I believe, what I care about, what I have experienced, good or bad, how I live, what I do, to just name a few. Nothing. You don't have a clue.

I don't know why you think you have to insult me personally ... especially when you know nothing about me. So you can just take your insults and shove them. If you don't like what you are reading, just click on the little red x you see in the top right corner of your screen (if you are running on Windows).
Dancing_Doll
Posted: Saturday, October 9, 2010 12:55:22 PM

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Actually Bassman, as I scan back to your original posts directed to me (for example) you are rolling with the personal insults (eg. "If for example you, DD, don't like guys that treat women with respect, that's your choice and I'm fine with that" or "DD, you can stand behind your "nice guy" posts all you want, but you have nothing to teach me or anyone else here on this"). So, you can dish it out and, as you call it, 'slander and trash' people all you want, but you become righteously offended if anyone directs any comments back to you? Have you seen me at any point in this entire thread direct any comments to you personally? Nope. Have I busted out the oversized font to rant back at you? Nope. Now, is that because I finished top of my class in my internet anger management class last year? Or maybe it's really because I have a sense of humour which has been sorely lacking by a couple of people in this thread. I am still kind of surprised by the blatant over-reaction to such a commonly used "urban social term".

Now, I could choose to give myself a stress-induced nose bleed by angrily typing away about how I never said that I don't like guys that treat women with respect and how you don't know "jack shit about me", but I won't. Because I think for the more reasonable people reading this thread... they kinda already get it. icon_smile

Nobody was attacking you specifically. What "I" and a few others were trying to do was clarify the fact that satire is a legitimate literary genre employed by the author to create a humorous and entertaining statement about the concept of "the nice guy", as was the artist that drew those cartoons. I don't know if "nice guys" are missing the humour gene but that might be an interesting study for the critical thinkers over at Heartless Bitches International. In the meantime, it might be wise to stay away from SNL, MADtv, the Colbert Report and The Far Side comic strips in order to avoid such an unhealthy rise in blood pressure.

Oh, and just to clarify... Damon and I don't "believe" in cartoons. Not since grade school anyway. geek



Guest
Posted: Saturday, October 9, 2010 5:35:02 PM

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Ok, one final word from me on this thread. And so I won't offend the all too tender eyes of some of the readers here, I'll keep the font to its default size and I won't use any colors (who would have thought that would be an issue of contention? Some people will just grab at anything they can reach)...

If I say to somebody that if for example that person likes or does not like something, it's his or her decision and I'm fine with it, how is that an insult? I can't really see how the other remark quoted here could be perceived as a personal insult either , but so be it.
So, who was I slandering and trashing?

Someone has been getting a "stress-induced nose bleed by angrily typing away?" None of that here ... I never go near my keyboard when I'm even remotely angry. I will certainly not say that anybody has said anything that he or she did not, and you won't find any of that in any of my posts here. I'm sorry I can't seem to be able to say that about everyone else who has posted in this thread.

When somebody writes something overly negative about a certain group of people, no matter what group it is, the easy way out is to then say it's just satire, humor, or however anybody wants to name it. That enables a writer to just run roughshod over anybody he or she sees fit, all the while claiming it's just for fun. And the supporters of said writer run to defend him or her, saying it's just about a so-called "urban social term" and not about people, not in the least caring about the fact that the article in question may be totally spiteful, venomous, injurious and more often than not partially if not totally false. Sorry, that's too easy a way out, as any of the more reasonable people reading this thread would concur.

Nobody was attacking me specifically? Hmmm, I must have totally misread and misinterpreted Damon's last post. Nobody should be attacking me specifically anyway, unless the right to having an opinion is not allowed here.

As for the "critical thinkers" over at Heartless Bitches International, they would be ... where? Oh, yes ... that was probably a joke, too, or satire.

Oh, and thank you very much for worrying about my blood pressure. Rest assured, I've never had a problem with that, not even in my darkest days of having cancer. You should be so lucky. May I politely remind all of you that it is perhaps better that people who live in glass houses don't throw stones? I'm falsely accused of being righteously offended, but there is way more self-righteousness going on in the comments contained in the last post directed my way. Somebody really has a great opinion of herself here ... that's fine with me, too. Have it your way, I'll have it mine.

So OK, have fun with your cartoons, hideously "funny" bashing in the name of humor and satire, and what have you ... This is supposedly the Relationship Advice section of the Forum and not the Humor section where fun and satire normally belong; should there be a Hate and Bashing section somewhere, too? Some people would be having a field day in that section, and I will certainly not be among them.

Adieu.




Dancing_Doll
Posted: Saturday, October 9, 2010 7:12:17 PM

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Actually Bassman, most of my post was meant in jest, but it's obvious we both have a very different sense of humour. I really wasn't offended by your posts, nor was I actually insinuating that you (literally) had a rise in blood pressure. But you chose to engage with similar insinuations (eg. that I prefer men who have no respect for women) and I just chose to volley it back on a similar level after it happened a few times in this thread. Although mine was meant with humour, whereas yours probably was meant literally, even though I didn't take it as such at the time. happy8

Satire works for some people, and I suppose it might offend others that take it literally. In the past, it was the attention it drew by making social commentaries on issues that made it a vehicle for affecting change in society (by raising awareness through controversy). In layman's terms... it gets people talking. And the rest of the time, it's really just a style of humour that a lot of people seem to enjoy and understand. I'd say most concepts of humour run the risk of offending people if you look at the average comedy skit, or satirical movie (eg. Borat). But that's getting off point here.

Behind the satirical twist, there are elements of truth to the subject matter. I don't think the author has any obligation to be PC in her opinions. She is just stating the kind of characteristics that she finds unattractive in a man. Her opinion is pretty much shared with a lot women out there today. Whether women term this kind of guy a "nice guy", or "obsessive clingy guy", or "insecure, doormat guy"... it really doesn't matter. But I'll bet this thread would be hard-pressed to find a woman who would post and say "yes, I read the article, and the author is way off base because that is exactly the kind of man that I'm looking for!". Although, who knows... stranger things have happened.

As MMonroe originally intended when she posted this article, was to explain to men the kind of things that turn women off. There seems to be many questions by men (both in the forum and in life in general) about what women are looking for, and the extreme stereotypes of "nice guy" vs "bad boy". This article meant to demystify what most women mean what they use that "urban social term".

As you will notice, I have made this post completely devoid of humour or entertainment value, so as to not inflame anyone who doesn't understand it. glasses8


WellMadeMale
Posted: Saturday, October 9, 2010 7:31:29 PM

Rank: Constant Gardener

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Can anyone spell: High Fucking Maintenance?

Oh, I think I just did. With 11 beers in my gut, even. Beat that...all you alcoholic Lushies!

Obscenity is the last refuge of an inarticulate motherfucker.
DamonX
Posted: Saturday, October 9, 2010 7:48:39 PM

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Quote:
If you don't like what you are reading, just click on the little red x you see in the top right corner of your screen (if you are running on Windows).


I actually love what I've been reading! evil4

Guest
Posted: Saturday, October 9, 2010 9:06:51 PM

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dontknow

I think this whole thread went sideways and around a bend ....

time for a drink ... hey, WMM ... Cheers!!


Van
Dancing_Doll
Posted: Saturday, October 9, 2010 9:19:24 PM

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WellMadeMale wrote:
Can anyone spell: High Fucking Maintenance?

Oh, I think I just did. With 11 beers in my gut, even. Beat that...all you alcoholic Lushies!


It appears that this thread owes you a drink (and to anyone else that had the masochistic energy to read through this entire mangled drama-rama!)

Enjoy... glasses8



Disclaimer: this post may contain humour that is harmful to your sensitivities. Please view with caution.







Guest
Posted: Sunday, October 10, 2010 7:54:47 AM

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I love nice guys. I'm living with one. He adores me, we get on extremely well and he calms me down. I used to go out with errmmm non-nice guys and they just treated me like shit. I've learned to look beyond all that physical and macho bullshit and find the person within. I think it's a growing up thing.
Guest
Posted: Tuesday, November 23, 2010 11:03:23 PM

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mercianknight wrote:


Sooooo.... I have decided to re-classify the article as relating to 'Clingy Door mats'. Moving on. binky binky binky

Good post.


I must agree here; in that "nice guy" is perhaps the wrong term to be using to describe an insecure, spineless individual that perceives his favours to be taken as his true worth. Doormat and "has no balls" would be more befitting.
Guest
Posted: Friday, November 26, 2010 3:50:28 AM

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I think the article is too black and white. According to the logic of the writer, Nice Guys are some sort of sect who share their DNA, and behave as a whole, with the same patterns and defects.

And then, the rest of men...of which, there's no example whatsoever.

Let's face it: we all (men) have Nice Guyish days, and not so Nice Guyish days.

Dont women suffer similar mood changes? Dont women wake up one day feeling like shopping, some other day feeling like spending the evening at home watching soap operas, and some other day they feel like going to a bukkake session?

The article casts some pathologic traits on this so-called Nice Guys group of people, and I think that level of bitterness is reached after many years of dating assholes...which is the writers fault, so I guess she is just venting her own fustrations and whining about her own sentimental failure.

IMO.
Magical_felix
Posted: Friday, November 26, 2010 9:05:17 AM

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This article may be written jokingly but I thought it was 100% true. A few of my friends are "Nice guys" and they are the most bitter, self loathing sad sacks. Dressed in their khaki pants and shitty old navy tshirt with a giants baseball cap. Staring into their beer at the bar instead of talking and trying to actually be attractive to women....

They'll say shit like:

"look at that guy he isn't even talking to his girlfriend"

"If I was with her she'd be my queen."

"look at that douchebag over there he thinks he's the shit." (the douchebag being a guy with women)

They sit around wondering why pretty girls just don't like nice guys Like them only assholes boohoo... Look in the mirror, shave, get a haircut, buy some grownup clothes, grow a pair and go talk to woman.

Dancing_Doll
Posted: Friday, November 26, 2010 9:52:45 AM

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Magical_felix wrote:
This article may be written jokingly but I thought it was 100% true. A few of my friends are "Nice guys" and they are the most bitter, self loathing sad sacks. Dressed in their khaki pants and shitty old navy tshirt with a giants baseball cap. Staring into their beer at the bar instead of talking and trying to actually be attractive to women....

They'll say shit like:

"look at that guy he isn't even talking to his girlfriend"

"If I was with her she'd be my queen."

"look at that douchebag over there he thinks he's the shit." (the douchebag being a guy with women)

They sit around wondering why pretty girls just don't like nice guys Like them only assholes boohoo... Look in the mirror, shave, get a haircut, buy some grownup clothes, grow a pair and go talk to woman.


I totally agree, Felix. I often find these are the kinds of guys that set their sights on an unattainable woman though (someway way out of their league) and try to woo her by playing the friend card and offering to help her move or hook up her WiFi. Then they rush in after her boyfriend breaks up with her and offer a shoulder to cry on, and then get pissed off when the woman doesn't fall madly in love with them. As much as people want to feel sorry for this type of guy, people don't notice the way they bypass and overlook nice/plain girls that they are probably better suited to because they aren't "hot enough". They prefer to live the dream and think they deserve the "perfect 10", and then whine about how she must be the type to prefer assholes when they can't get her. Sometimes this type of guy can be just as self-involved and arrogant as a typical jerk... it just comes across in a different way.


Guest
Posted: Friday, November 26, 2010 10:04:55 AM

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hehehe @ Jack. That is so funny, I know those loser boys from the bars and clubs. The khaki and tshirt thing is hilarious! Always wondered what they were grumbling too, so thanks for that.

Some guys are so nice but so bitter about how nice they are, and can't deal with women like a normal person. Its like being a nice guy is in their head and don't have confidence but the excuse is that they don't want to disrespect? Poor nice guys :( If they werent mad about it, it would sometimes be cute, like in the movies.

Magical_felix
Posted: Friday, November 26, 2010 10:50:24 AM

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Joined: 4/3/2010
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Yes definitely these guys swing for the fences with unattainable women and get more and more bitter with each strike out.

Guest
Posted: Saturday, November 27, 2010 4:18:15 AM

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Joined: 12/1/2006
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Magical_felix wrote:
This article may be written jokingly but I thought it was 100% true. A few of my friends are "Nice guys" and they are the most bitter, self loathing sad sacks. Dressed in their khaki pants and shitty old navy tshirt with a giants baseball cap. Staring into their beer at the bar instead of talking and trying to actually be attractive to women....

They'll say shit like:

"look at that guy he isn't even talking to his girlfriend"

"If I was with her she'd be my queen."

"look at that douchebag over there he thinks he's the shit." (the douchebag being a guy with women)

They sit around wondering why pretty girls just don't like nice guys Like them only assholes boohoo... Look in the mirror, shave, get a haircut, buy some grownup clothes, grow a pair and go talk to woman.




True. Sometimes I love to watch the comments of people on amateur porn sites, comments like "what a small dick", or "he could be pumping all day long and wont make her cum", or "why would she be with that fat guy"...and I just think "okay, he's got an small dick, but he's shagging and you are wanking at your computer watching him shag".


MMonroe
Posted: Saturday, November 27, 2010 7:07:54 AM

Rank: Forum Guru

Joined: 4/10/2009
Posts: 1,897
Location: United Kingdom
Dancing_Doll wrote:
Magical_felix wrote:
This article may be written jokingly but I thought it was 100% true. A few of my friends are "Nice guys" and they are the most bitter, self loathing sad sacks. Dressed in their khaki pants and shitty old navy tshirt with a giants baseball cap. Staring into their beer at the bar instead of talking and trying to actually be attractive to women....

They'll say shit like:

"look at that guy he isn't even talking to his girlfriend"

"If I was with her she'd be my queen."

"look at that douchebag over there he thinks he's the shit." (the douchebag being a guy with women)

They sit around wondering why pretty girls just don't like nice guys Like them only assholes boohoo... Look in the mirror, shave, get a haircut, buy some grownup clothes, grow a pair and go talk to woman.


I totally agree, Felix. I often find these are the kinds of guys that set their sights on an unattainable woman though (someway way out of their league) and try to woo her by playing the friend card and offering to help her move or hook up her WiFi. Then they rush in after her boyfriend breaks up with her and offer a shoulder to cry on, and then get pissed off when the woman doesn't fall madly in love with them. As much as people want to feel sorry for this type of guy, people don't notice the way they bypass and overlook nice/plain girls that they are probably better suited to because they aren't "hot enough". They prefer to live the dream and think they deserve the "perfect 10", and then whine about how she must be the type to prefer assholes when they can't get her. Sometimes this type of guy can be just as self-involved and arrogant as a typical jerk... it just comes across in a different way.



Too damn true. Even when you're friends with them and for whatever reason cant come out for a drink, they take it personally as though you are avoiding them. This is all i was trying to explain by posting the article
WellMadeMale
Posted: Saturday, November 27, 2010 10:58:31 AM

Rank: Constant Gardener

Joined: 9/30/2009
Posts: 10,758
Location: Cakeland, United States
This thread is hilarious. Where's my Butthurt Report form, I seem to have misplaced my folder containing them.

Obscenity is the last refuge of an inarticulate motherfucker.
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