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What's your opinion on abortion? Options · View
kiera
Posted: Saturday, July 27, 2013 12:17:17 PM

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T leave now enough, who cares what she thinks, miss flashy pants lol..... don't make me call Ginger, babes this is understandably a very very hard topic for you, and you certainly do not need slippery people being cruel, lets leave and hit the groundless lies forum ok x
Dani
Posted: Saturday, July 27, 2013 12:18:04 PM

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trinket wrote:



and AGAIN, there is no need for you to be so rude to me. This is a discussion thread as you pointed out to me a couple of days ago. I haven't told anyone on this thread their opinions are wrong, I have not said that my reasoning of being pro-life surpasses that of pro-choicers, and I have not told anyone else on this thread they or their opinions are ignorant.

Quit with the name calling Slippery, it's supposed to be a discussion. You ARE singling me out and attacking me for my views. Views that I am entitled to voice without fear of being called ignorant or any other names by YOU.





You're neither being singled out nor attacked. I quoted Kiera too...and other people I disagreed with. Did you see that? I never called you ignorant. I never called your opinions ignorant. What I have done is express respect for your opinions and anyone else's while disagreeing with some statements you have made,and yes, calling your blanket statements ignorant.Because they are. All blanket statements are ignorant. Even the blanket statement I just made about blanket statements is ignorant. See, I just called myself ignorant? Well not myself per se...just the blanket statement I made.

I'm not attacking your views. Your views are very much understandable and identifiable. Your tact...or lack thereof, is what bothers me.



Dani
Posted: Saturday, July 27, 2013 12:21:25 PM

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kiera wrote:
T leave now enough, who cares what she thinks, miss flashy pants lol..... don't make me call Ginger, babes this is understandably a very very hard topic for you, and you certainly do not need slippery people being cruel, lets leave and hit the groundless lies forum ok x


Oh, Kiera. I could say more. I really could. But you do it for me. Thank you so much. I wholeheartedly appreciate you.



Magical_felix
Posted: Saturday, July 27, 2013 12:22:45 PM

Rank: Wild at Heart

Joined: 4/3/2010
Posts: 7,918
Location: California
trinket wrote:



Thanks for agreeing that I'm being attacked Jack. Don't tell me not to post on the forums, it's a public forum.


It's a public forum, correct, not your personal whining and crybaby tactics whenever someone says something you don't like blog. Someone says something you don't like and you focus on "rules" and forum "decorum" and words like "troll" or "attacking" or "bully" to tattletale when someone says something you disagree with. It's so transparent. You're just a huge baby. Grow up.



Magical_felix
Posted: Saturday, July 27, 2013 12:26:07 PM

Rank: Wild at Heart

Joined: 4/3/2010
Posts: 7,918
Location: California
kiera wrote:
T leave now enough, who cares what she thinks, miss flashy pants lol..... don't make me call Ginger, babes this is understandably a very very hard topic for you, and you certainly do not need slippery people being cruel, lets leave and hit the groundless lies forum ok x


Please call ginger... Oh my god that will be so funny!

Guest
Posted: Saturday, July 27, 2013 12:34:54 PM

Rank: Lurker

Joined: 12/1/2006
Posts: 816,693
I think ts something both parties have the right to discuss, and if they can't get ti an overall conclusions then its not fair on the child to bring it into the world if one parent doesn want it
Guest
Posted: Saturday, July 27, 2013 12:44:49 PM

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Joined: 12/1/2006
Posts: 816,693
slipperywhenwet2012 wrote:


You're neither being singled out nor attacked. I quoted Kiera too...and other people I disagreed with. Did you see that? I never called you ignorant. I never called your opinions ignorant. What I have done is express respect for your opinions and anyone else's while disagreeing with some statements you have made,and yes, calling your blanket statements ignorant.Because they are. All blanket statements are ignorant. Even the blanket statement I just made about blanket statements is ignorant. See, I just called myself ignorant? Well not myself per se...just the blanket statement I made.

I'm not attacking your views. Your views are very much understandable and identifiable. Your tact...or lack thereof, is what bothers me.



slipperywhenwet2012 wrote:

It's also fine that I think that is the most ignorant line of thinking I've ever come across. I'm fine with your ignorance. I accept your ignorance. Why can't you be fine with my disagreement and acceptance of your ignorance?







Dani
Posted: Saturday, July 27, 2013 12:52:12 PM

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trinket wrote:
slipperywhenwet2012 wrote:


You're neither being singled out nor attacked. I quoted Kiera too...and other people I disagreed with. Did you see that? I never called you ignorant. I never called your opinions ignorant. What I have done is express respect for your opinions and anyone else's while disagreeing with some statements you have made,and yes, calling your blanket statements ignorant.Because they are. All blanket statements are ignorant. Even the blanket statement I just made about blanket statements is ignorant. See, I just called myself ignorant? Well not myself per se...just the blanket statement I made.

I'm not attacking your views. Your views are very much understandable and identifiable. Your tact...or lack thereof, is what bothers me.



slipperywhenwet2012 wrote:

It's also fine that I think that is the most ignorant line of thinking I've ever come across. I'm fine with your ignorance. I accept your ignorance. Why can't you be fine with my disagreement and acceptance of your ignorance?



Thanks for going through the trouble of drumming up my posts to prove I never called you or your opinions ignorant. Just your line of thinking...and your blanket statements.Saved me all the trouble. Isn't it great when people prove your points for you?

I would thank you more, but I'm too busy being offended by you singling out and attacking me by showing me what I've said in previous posts. It's such a callous thing to do.



MadMartigan
Posted: Saturday, July 27, 2013 12:59:12 PM

Rank: Raised on Blackroot

Joined: 6/17/2013
Posts: 2,322
Location: United States
Ugh.

People. Being called ignorant isn't the great insult some of you make it out to be. Fuck, we're all born ignorant. We're all ignorant about a great many things.

And for fucks sake, why must we be so sensitive online?

slippery isn't being mean, condescending, or rude...

Even if she were, my god. Why continue posting on this topic? If something upsets you, leave off.

Anyway, Trinket, you haven't exactly done yourself favors in the way you phrase things as well as they way you step on your own toes with your posts. You create a circular argument for yourself.

All slippery wants you to understand, I imagine, is that women shouldn't be demonized for their own decisions. It's theirs and theirs alone. No need to call out folks you've never met.
Shylass
Posted: Saturday, July 27, 2013 1:00:58 PM

Rank: Gingerbread Lover

Joined: 1/6/2012
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Location: Wiggleton, United Kingdom
I just remembered why I hardly ever read the Think Tank threads.



Ut incepit fidelis, sic permanet.

***
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Monocle
Posted: Saturday, July 27, 2013 1:06:53 PM

Rank: Forum Guru

Joined: 2/19/2007
Posts: 301
trinket wrote:

Sprite, I understand what you are saying, mistakes happen. That is my whole point, having to carry a child to full term is a consequence of poor judgement, not a punishment for poor judgement. People who are Pro-Choice look at it from the woman's POV and the right to choose what happens to her body. People who are Pro-Life look at it from the foetus's POV.


A foetus doesn't have a point of view. We - you - give it sentience it does not have. You wish to grant it rights it should not have. A foetus' right to life is by definition the enslavement of the mother if she is unwilling. Until such time as you can rescue any unwanted foetus and carry it to term ex-vitro, the woman's body is her jurisdiction.
sprite
Posted: Saturday, July 27, 2013 1:06:57 PM

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Shylass wrote:
I just remembered why I hardly ever read the Think Tank threads.



cause they... give you seizures....? Regaeman Man



Love not hate.
AriOli101
Posted: Saturday, July 27, 2013 1:29:58 PM

Rank: Forum Guru

Joined: 7/3/2013
Posts: 353
Location: United Kingdom
CoolCatLovesFucks wrote:
I mean god but a living thing in your body for a reason . Abortion shouldn't be an option . You could always put it up for adoption so someone who cant have kids will get their dream .


Your opinion, and I respect you for that.

However, do you have any idea how hard it is for a mother to give up their child?

Seriously, there's a whole bunch of bonding from the third trimester, then there's all the "placing in the mothers arms" stuff.

So I've been told, it's just as difficult. It's not as simple as, "Oops, I've popped out a baby! Here ya go, adoptive parents!"

Make love not horcruxes! >^_^<

Check out my stories, you'd be surprised what I can do :)
Guest
Posted: Saturday, July 27, 2013 1:55:06 PM

Rank: Lurker

Joined: 12/1/2006
Posts: 816,693
Think So many elitist's.
kiera
Posted: Saturday, July 27, 2013 2:44:03 PM

Rank: Short Arse Brit

Joined: 3/23/2013
Posts: 18,339
Location: Sipping tea , United Kingdom
slipperywhenwet2012 wrote:


Oh, Kiera. I could say more. I really could. But you do it for me. Thank you so much. I wholeheartedly appreciate you.


LMAO babes hit me with your wisdom stick, all 24 years of them lmao xoxo
Dani
Posted: Saturday, July 27, 2013 3:30:40 PM

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kiera wrote:


LMAO babes hit me with your wisdom stick, all 24 years of them lmao xoxo


For curiosity's sake, what does my age have to do with you making fun of yourself in a thread about abortion?



kiera
Posted: Saturday, July 27, 2013 4:01:18 PM

Rank: Short Arse Brit

Joined: 3/23/2013
Posts: 18,339
Location: Sipping tea , United Kingdom
slipperywhenwet2012 wrote:


For curiosity's sake, what does my age have to do with you making fun of yourself in a thread about abortion?


Do you have children love and i may add i did try to stop this antagonism , and get the forum back on track, i guess u disagree x
Dani
Posted: Saturday, July 27, 2013 4:08:28 PM

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kiera wrote:


Do you have children love and i may add i did try to stop this antagonism , and get the forum back on track, i guess u disagree x


The forum was always on track. Your pseudo-snide remarks keep derailing it.

Why does it matter to you whether or not I have children? That information is my own and has nothing to do with the subject at hand, and you're not entitled to it.

It has nothing to do with my opinion on abortion. I speak as a woman who has jurisdiction over her own body and wants to keep it that way.



Guest
Posted: Saturday, July 27, 2013 5:10:47 PM

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Joined: 12/1/2006
Posts: 816,693
I am pro-life all the way. But it is a woman's prerogative whatever she wants to do. That's all that needs to be said on that topic.
Guest
Posted: Sunday, July 28, 2013 1:34:38 AM

Rank: Lurker

Joined: 12/1/2006
Posts: 816,693
MadMartigan wrote:
Can't we all just agree that women deserve to the right to choose and that they shouldn't be demonized and made to feel like devils on Earth for choosing what they deem necessary?

Making up hypotheticals where women enjoy the procedure, that women get "9" abortions, and judging women who abort as a whole (or in minority groups) without knowing their life story or situation is disingenuous, disturbing, and lacks all compassion.

To say women enjoy it is kind of sickening to me...The public already, and even the legislature in the US (as well as cops) dehumanize women enough already in things like rape..

How about we NOT demonize those poor souls.


I wasn't making hypotheticals. If you read my comment I said I personally know women that do it. Women that I grew up with, who obviously had different upbringings than I did. I wasn't saying it for the sake of argument, I was stating a fact. I'm not dehumanizing or demonizing them. How is telling the truth of what they did "dehumanizing" or "demonizing"?

As I said there should be exceptions, but where do you draw the line? Yes there is a big difference between consensual and nonconsensual sex. I was referring to consenting adults, and the ones who are irresponsible about sex. I'm not saying be celibate for the rest of your life either. I'm simply saying be responsible and have safe sex if you don't want to have children. If you don't want to have safe sex, then don't have it until you can be responsible enough to do it safely.

Here's a hypothetical: If you know you're going to get aids by having unprotected sex with someone, and you still have sex with them thinking that you'll be that .01% of people who don't contract it, will you blame your partner who gave the aids to you, or do you accept the responsibility for knowingly having unprotected sex and took the risk getting it?

Another hypothetical: What if it was your pet? If you knew you couldn't afford to care for a litter of pups or kittens, would you still allow your pet to go mate while they're in heat? Would you get them fixed to prevent them from breeding? Would you make them get a procedure to terminate their litter early in the development, or let them carry to term and after they're weened, you give them new homes?

I understand that women deserve rights, but of all the rights you could have, why do you want the right to end a life you knowingly took the risk of creating? I'm not judging, I'm simply stating my opinion on the matter and stating facts about women I know, women who I grew up with, who have done the procedure multiple times.

Yes I know that all women shouldn't be "punished" just because of the actions of a few. But it's not just a few from one town in America. There's women like that everywhere. It's not just one rare case. Maybe making a law against abortion will give the irresponsible women an incentive to be more responsible when they have sex, or encourage them to wait until they're in the right situation when they can handle the responsibility and provide for a child. Like I said in my original post, there should be exceptions, but you have to draw a line somewhere.

How would you feel if you found out that your mother wanted to abort you, but your mother's parents wouldn't let her? How would you feel knowing that there was a possibility of your existence ending in the early stages simply because your mother didn't want the burden of raising you? I imagine it being similar to children finding out that when they were a baby or a toddler, their parents gave them away for a while because they didn't want responsibility, then when they were good and ready they wanted you back.

Women who are raped should have the option to have an abortion. Women who have conceived a child of incest should have the option of getting an abortion due to the possibility of genetic mutations and deformities. Women who can't carry to term because they could die or the baby could die should have the option to have an abortion. Women who have debilitating diseases running in their families that are genetically dominant traits should have the option to have an abortion. When you think about it, those are hypotheticals as well.

I never said I was completely against abortion, I said there should be exceptions, but there should also be a line drawn.
Magical_felix
Posted: Sunday, July 28, 2013 2:36:40 AM

Rank: Wild at Heart

Joined: 4/3/2010
Posts: 7,918
Location: California
htowngirl1990 wrote:


Another hypothetical: What if it was your pet? If you knew you couldn't afford to care for a litter of pups or kittens, would you still allow your pet to go mate while they're in heat? Would you get them fixed to prevent them from breeding? Would you make them get a procedure to terminate their litter early in the development, or let them carry to term and after they're weened, you give them new homes?


Like if my beautiful chocolate Lab was like, "woof woof!" And I was like, "what's that girl!?, some irresponsible junkie chihuahua got you pregnant in a well!?" And she was like, "Bark, BARK!" And I was like "what's that girl!? You think an abortion is best because I'm broke? That damn chihuahua isn't even house broken? And you are concerned because I already get the cheapest dog food their is!?". "Bark bark! Woof!" She says. Then I woud be like, "it's your body and your foresight my excitible young bitch. I respect your decision. Now get in the car and don't drool on the seat. We are getting you the abortion you feel is the best choice. Because its your body and life and that chihuahua was damn seductive but we both know he will be a nightmare of a father... I love you baby."

scarlet
Posted: Sunday, July 28, 2013 3:39:47 AM

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kiera wrote:


LMAO babes hit me with your wisdom stick, all 24 years of them lmao xoxo


Just a quick. Does my age mean I have no wisdom or right to put my view across on this topic too? I'm younger than slippery at 22 but I have the some what unique view of having had a miscarriage, an abortion and 3 children.

My 2 cents Don't hit out at age, it really is disrespectful.

Monocle
Posted: Sunday, July 28, 2013 8:42:09 AM

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Joined: 2/19/2007
Posts: 301
htowngirl1990 wrote:

Yes I know that all women shouldn't be "punished" just because of the actions of a few. But it's not just a few from one town in America. There's women like that everywhere. It's not just one rare case. Maybe making a law against abortion will give the irresponsible women an incentive to be more responsible when they have sex, or encourage them to wait until they're in the right situation when they can handle the responsibility and provide for a child. Like I said in my original post, there should be exceptions, but you have to draw a line somewhere.


Yep. You _do_ want to restrict and effectively punish all women due to the irresponsibility of a few. If you look at abortion statistics across the country and the world, you would know your personal experience is non-representative.

It's true - you do have to draw the line somewhere. I draw the line around the woman's body. Others' right to interfere with her choices ends at that line. One could make the argument that there are lots of places the line is way farther out than that, too, but that's another discussion.

jollylolly
Posted: Sunday, July 28, 2013 9:27:56 AM

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Location: Texas, United States
htowngirl1990 wrote:


Don't be irresponsible, it's an innocent life at stake. I personally know several women my age, younger and older who get pregnant just to go get an abortion so they can get the drugs they prescribe for pain. Others who get an abortion just because they don't want the responsibility. And some who do it because they like the way they feel during the process of it. It's appalling, ridiculous, downright disgusting.



Really?! I guess anything is possible, but this sounds like the kind of thing that the kookier anti-abortion groups say to paint women who have abortions as totally depraved and immoral.
Around 1/3 of American women will have an abortion during their lifetime, I seriously doubt the majority of women are having abortions for these reasons.
sprite
Posted: Sunday, July 28, 2013 9:32:22 AM

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htowngirl1990 wrote:


I never said I was completely against abortion, I said there should be exceptions, but there should also be a line drawn.


and who would like to take on the job of deciding where that line is? is it going to be hard line, a soft line? what? how is it going to be enforced? what is it going to be based on? is some doctor in his office going to have girls brought in one by one, have them tell their story in 5 sentences for less and then stamp their paperwork either 'yes' or 'no' and send them on their way, full well knowing that some of them are going to go to Dr Mike and his magic coat wire with a pocket full of 20s? What do you tell a 16 yo girl who is going to be forced to drop out of High School and lose the scholarship to UCLA that she worked so hard to get because she got talked into getting drunk one night and had sex? Sorry, babe, but i'm sure you and your baby will do just fine out there on your own. These are the kind of questions you need to look at when you decide the fate of, potentially, every single woman in this country by deciding to out law abortions.

oh, a lot of foes of abortion, btw, are also against planned parenthood - that means they are also trying to limit a woman's right to get birth control, so yeah, pretty soon our options are going to be this - have babies or give up sex. yeah, such progressive thinking. would someone please explain to me why someone would want to single out the RESPONSIBLE teen aged girl who is going to have sex and WANTS to prevent pregnancy, telling her 'sorry, no way, not helping you' and then is going to make a case about teen pregnancies? dude, teens are going to have sex. period. you are against abortions? make it possible for them to avoid getting pregnant in the first place.

My 2 cents



Love not hate.
MadMartigan
Posted: Sunday, July 28, 2013 9:54:42 AM

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jollylolly wrote:


Really?! I guess anything is possible, but this sounds like the kind of thing that the kookier anti-abortion groups say to paint women who have abortions as totally depraved and immoral.
Around 1/3 of American women will have an abortion during their lifetime, I seriously doubt the majority of women are having abortions for these reasons.



I think that this had to be made up...And I say that from women telling me abortions are unpleasant experiences.

Enjoy it?

Get pregnant to get the drugs?

I'm sorry. I'm calling BS on that. That's exactly the kind of propaganda right-wing nuts launch into the public sphere to paint abortion and the women who get them as demonic monsters.

There may very well be these types of people around, but I'm guessing they account for 0.0000001% of the women who get abortions. Yea, I made that statistic up. Just like that stat htowngirl1990 pulled from her ass.

There are sick assholes all around the world. But let's not punish the vast majority for the sins of a handful of idiots.
Guest
Posted: Sunday, July 28, 2013 9:59:32 AM

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Joined: 12/1/2006
Posts: 816,693
htowngirl1990 wrote:



I never said I was completely against abortion, I said there should be exceptions, but there should also be a line drawn.


Draw your line wherever you want, and let other women do the same.
Dani
Posted: Sunday, July 28, 2013 10:18:21 AM

Rank: Big-Haired Bitch
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Joined: 12/25/2010
Posts: 7,202
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htowngirl1990 wrote:


I wasn't making hypotheticals. If you read my comment I said I personally know women that do it. Women that I grew up with, who obviously had different upbringings than I did. I wasn't saying it for the sake of argument, I was stating a fact. I'm not dehumanizing or demonizing them. How is telling the truth of what they did "dehumanizing" or "demonizing"?

As I said there should be exceptions, but where do you draw the line? Yes there is a big difference between consensual and nonconsensual sex. I was referring to consenting adults, and the ones who are irresponsible about sex. I'm not saying be celibate for the rest of your life either. I'm simply saying be responsible and have safe sex if you don't want to have children. If you don't want to have safe sex, then don't have it until you can be responsible enough to do it safely.

Here's a hypothetical: If you know you're going to get aids by having unprotected sex with someone, and you still have sex with them thinking that you'll be that .01% of people who don't contract it, will you blame your partner who gave the aids to you, or do you accept the responsibility for knowingly having unprotected sex and took the risk getting it?

Another hypothetical: What if it was your pet? If you knew you couldn't afford to care for a litter of pups or kittens, would you still allow your pet to go mate while they're in heat? Would you get them fixed to prevent them from breeding? Would you make them get a procedure to terminate their litter early in the development, or let them carry to term and after they're weened, you give them new homes?

I understand that women deserve rights, but of all the rights you could have, why do you want the right to end a life you knowingly took the risk of creating? I'm not judging, I'm simply stating my opinion on the matter and stating facts about women I know, women who I grew up with, who have done the procedure multiple times.

Yes I know that all women shouldn't be "punished" just because of the actions of a few. But it's not just a few from one town in America. There's women like that everywhere. It's not just one rare case. Maybe making a law against abortion will give the irresponsible women an incentive to be more responsible when they have sex, or encourage them to wait until they're in the right situation when they can handle the responsibility and provide for a child. Like I said in my original post, there should be exceptions, but you have to draw a line somewhere.

How would you feel if you found out that your mother wanted to abort you, but your mother's parents wouldn't let her? How would you feel knowing that there was a possibility of your existence ending in the early stages simply because your mother didn't want the burden of raising you? I imagine it being similar to children finding out that when they were a baby or a toddler, their parents gave them away for a while because they didn't want responsibility, then when they were good and ready they wanted you back.

Women who are raped should have the option to have an abortion. Women who have conceived a child of incest should have the option of getting an abortion due to the possibility of genetic mutations and deformities. Women who can't carry to term because they could die or the baby could die should have the option to have an abortion. Women who have debilitating diseases running in their families that are genetically dominant traits should have the option to have an abortion. When you think about it, those are hypotheticals as well.

I never said I was completely against abortion, I said there should be exceptions, but there should also be a line drawn.


Here's the thing. I read what you said. I see your point of view. 20% of it made sense...sort of. Now for the other 80%.

You mean to tell me if I get pregnant and don't want it, I walk into the abortion clinic and the doc says, "OK. Was the sex consensual? Did you take all necessary precautions? Did you have birth control? Did he use a condom? Did the condom break? Did the birth control also fail?...Oh. You took none of those precautions? Abortion denied." That's fair to you?

As a woman, I shouldn't have to explain or justify. I understand pre-counseling and being given a run down of my options. But suppose I am the type that likes to get abortion for the thrill of it? Why is that any of your concern? It's not your body. It's not your fetus. What I do with my body shouldn't need justification. If getting pregnant and then getting it aborted is a hobby of mine, it's still not your concern. It will never be your concern.

I don't care about what reasons are and aren't acceptable. I don't care about lines being drawn and crossed. I don't care about limits. It's about my rights as a woman to do what I want with my body without someone saying under what conditions I can and can't do what I want with my body.

I've said it before, and I'll say it again...it's this kind of small-minded, linear thinking that will lead to the justification of our rights as women being denied. Do you think it's just about abortion, people? Wake up and see the big picture. angry7



Dani
Posted: Sunday, July 28, 2013 10:24:29 AM

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racking wrote:


Just a quick. Does my age mean I have no wisdom or right to put my view across on this topic too? I'm younger than slippery at 22 but I have the somewhat unique view of having had a miscarriage, an abortion and 3 children.

My 2 cents Don't hit out at age, it really is disrespectful.



Shh. Your logic has no power in the direction you're throwing it.

Besides, she makes fun of herself without realizing it. It's much more entertaining that way.



MadMartigan
Posted: Sunday, July 28, 2013 10:29:46 AM

Rank: Raised on Blackroot

Joined: 6/17/2013
Posts: 2,322
Location: United States
The last thing I'll say on the matter is that you'd best be damn careful what you ask for. Putting in provisions and stipulations to when, if, how, etc, etc, certain unalienable rights can be granted to us or anyone else will lead us on a path to a future you just aren't going to like...

Once you start making laws and provisions over a persons own damn body, you open yourself up to a world of hurt. What would be next?

You or the woman can't use her breasts in the act of sex because they are only there to nurse babies post-pregnancy?

Sexual relations are outlawed only except to breed?

Mandatory child for every woman once they are in their child-bearing peak?

Yes, these are all gross exercises of hyperbole, but don't think there are certain lunatic fringes who'd do it if they could.
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