Forum posts made by principessa

Topic Your thoughts on Trump's Zero Tolerance Policy & separating children
Posted 20 Jun 2018 17:28

Wow! That's pretty aggressive rhetoric. My pure guess is that you've either been brought up in a very privileged/affluent background or someone's been feeding you a steady diet of Progressive Politics.

I was brought up on a diet of progressive politics by hardworking parents. I am thankful for that. What is your explanation for your world view? Right wing talk radio until it was replaced by Fox News?

Trump is turning himself into a pretzel now trying to justify what he did while ending the separation of families for now. He reacted to condemnation from almost all who saw the images of these children, some for obvious reasons, others in his party because they feared because they would not be reelected. We do not know what will happen to the 2200 children now in custody.

Bannon, Miller, and Nielsen all pushed him to thinking it would play to his base and lied that it was rooted in law. They bet on this being politically advantageous and they lost hugely (!!) This is a defeat for Trump.

Topic President Trump Nominated for Nobel Peace Prize by Norwegian Lawmakers
Posted 19 Jun 2018 17:33


Now let's return to the thread topic.

The Nobel Peace Prize should be earned before it's awarded.

Agreed. So when Kim has dismantled his nukes and agreed to independent inspections, when his ability to manufacture more of them is also dismantled, and when he returns the remains still in NK from the Korean War, perhaps both he and Trump could be considered.

Having a meeting with Kiim in which he adopted Kim's language about military exercises, made no demands of him, fawned over him embarrassingly and got no firm commitments from him does not bear consideration for the award for Trump alone.

As an aside, it seems that Trump has more regard for Kim than for my PM, Justin Trudeau. There is something wrong with that.

Topic RUMPLATIONS: Awesome Honky Tonk and Cyber Bar
Posted 19 Jun 2018 14:00

Hello everyone. Almost 5 PM here and it has been a hellish day. So, I'll have a gin and tonic please.

Interesting conversation about writers, stories, and readers. I know that there was a time when it seemed that there was some great writing being published here, and much of it written by strong personalities. For good or for ill, I think that the strong personalities are now shown in threads in the Think Tank, rather than creative writing. I have not written anything new in a long while. I know that my work whether solo or with co-writers like Milik was well received, but not to the extent of some other writers. I believe that I progressed from writing that really strung together sex scenes to writing real stories with characters that have some depth. Maybe that is not what the majority of people want, rather showing up for some quick stimulation and release. Who knows? The number of members on the site has skyrocketed in the time I have been here, and perhaps a good proportion of them are less invested in quality writing than we would hope for.

I am not sure that the Incest issue is really that pertinent, given that the previous Taboo category was a thinly veiled version of it, just with the addition of step- to relationships.

Things happen so quickly now with pervasive social media and the short attention spans that they have engendered. Maybe we need a category for readers to get off after reading ten tweets. Of course, I am being facetious. But I do think that the spirit of the time is very different than it was five years ago.

I don't have any answers, but this discussion brings up interesting questions for us all to think about.

Cheers everyonoe.

Topic Your thoughts on Trump's Zero Tolerance Policy & separating children
Posted 18 Jun 2018 17:50

My guess is that President Trump will relax the "zero tolerance" policy, which was not one of his campaign promises, in exchange for funding for the Wall, which was.

I thought the same. He is doing this purposely knowing that it is dramatic and holding the children hostage for an immigration plan that includes funding for his stupid wall (a 14th century solution to a 21st century problem).

Topic Your thoughts on Trump's Zero Tolerance Policy & separating children
Posted 18 Jun 2018 17:26

what i want to know Liz,is who gave the order to put those kids in those cages,and why the FUCK theyre not facing a crimes against humanity charge

There's a thought. Amnesty International should investigate these detention centres and the procedures that get children placed there to bring charges of crimes against humanity. That would give Trump and the strangely cold Kirstjen Nielsen something to think about other than the minute possibility that he will get the Nobel.

Topic Your thoughts on Trump's Zero Tolerance Policy & separating children
Posted 18 Jun 2018 13:46

I am interested to hear opinions on what is happening at the border with families being separated and taken into custody. This is happening not only to teenage kids, but toddlers and even infants. Trump has said this is because of a law - not true, there is no such law, only a policy that he could change with the stroke of a pen. Sessions has quoted the Bible to bolster this, using the same kind of verses that were used to justify segregation.

I am naively hopeful that even conservatives here will not agree with this.

What does everyone think?

Topic President Trump Nominated for Nobel Peace Prize by Norwegian Lawmakers
Posted 18 Jun 2018 11:38

Simply put, you're wrong.

The winner of the summit, the guy who made sure that it happened in the first place, and the guy who will do everything he can to make sure he gets what he wants out of it, is this guy:

Take a good look at that picture. Get to know that face. He has recently been cleared by his government to have an unlimited number of terms as President of the most populous country in history, and intends to be the leader of the world's only superpower by 2020.

No. I am not wrong. Amazingly, I agree with you. (Pigs must be flying.) Kim is his proxy. Of course China and Russia win if the US withdraws its influence from the region and gives in so easily to Kim's dissembling.

Topic President Trump Nominated for Nobel Peace Prize by Norwegian Lawmakers
Posted 18 Jun 2018 09:23

There is no way that Trump deserves the Nobel Peace Prize. Kim was the winner in this negotiation. He made no solid commitments on demuclearization. There was more hyperbole than substance, including this nomination which came from a Norwegian politician who is anti-immigrant and right wing in the European version of the alt right.

Trump adopted hazy North Korean language on denuclearization, ditching more precise US arms control terms, defended Kim over the regime’s appalling human rights, and presented him with a gift in the form of a unilateral concession, the suspension of military exercises, not to mention the fawning adulation he showered on Kim.

Even if Trump did merit consideration, which he does not, what is happening with children being separated from their parents and detained by immigration authorities would nullify it.

Topic So who wants to talk about the Inspector General's report?
Posted 17 Jun 2018 09:04

That's the only play Damon has in his book. You'll notice that people like Damon, Felix, Jeff, Principessa - they never actually attack my arguments. They just spew hate. I actually feel sorry for them.

I have seen you insulting people personally. I have not done that, and not to you in particular. I actually have rarely argued with you as I see no point in doing it. You have shown us who and what you are and I believe you.

So, the only sorry you owe me is an apology for lumping me in with the others who spar with and occasionally attack you. If my expression of an opinion opposing yours offends you, you will have to learn to live with it.

Topic President Trump Nominated for Nobel Peace Prize by Norwegian Lawmakers
Posted 14 Jun 2018 09:45

Exactly the same thing can be said about Trump.

Topic The Trump Tariffs
Posted 12 Jun 2018 09:13

At this point all was can do is hope the rest of the world will let us forget trump and return to normal relations when we get this asswipe leaves office

That is exactly what the G6 (without Trump) will do. The Europeans, Canadians and the other industrialized democracies will carry on without the US. Trump has managed to abdicate any leadership held by the US with his bombast and ignorance. He alienates historic allies while cozying up to dictators. He has made Putin's dreams come true in undoing the western alliance that has lasted since WWII. Americans have always held themselves apart as somehow superior. That was never true, but now they are really set apart, not for good reasons. It will take a very long time to repair the damage done to all of these relationships.

Topic Anthony Bourdain
Posted 11 Jun 2018 12:57

I am rarely carried away with grief for celebrities beyond saying 'that's too bad" but this death really hit me. Anthony Bourdain was articulate and adventurous. He was a splendid writer and creator of documentaries that showed us so much more than food. That was the entryway to the culture of other people, learning about their lives and countries in the most human way. He was never smug or condescending and could relate with anyone anywhere over a meal. He taught us to walk away from the tourist areas of well known places to explore the neighbourhoods where people live and work and eat. That is how you get to know another country and people.

I will never forget the hilarious episode in Sicily (or perhaps it was Naples) where he arranged to go out fishing. He donned snorkeling gear and when he was in the water dead octopi were being tossed from two boats into the water to make him think that he was fishing for them. His outrage at this stupid scam was well deserved. There were many other episodes that took me to places I had never been and some that I had visited but not seen through his eyes. I recorded his show weekly and watched it with pleasure. I am grateful for sharing his adventures vicariously.

Tony Bourdain conquered heroin and cocaine addiction and various other excesses. He made a life for himself that seemed like a charmed one from the outside. It said he was away over 200 days annually. I wonder if this constant motion was part of being bipolar. Who knows? Clearly there were demons and darkness that he could not overcome, culminating in his suicide. I ache for his daughter and his friend Eric Ripert who found him. I hope his friends and loved ones find peace and that if there is another life somewhere that he too has found peace. He would be at a dinner table having great food, wine and conversation with other interesting people who are gone.

This is so, so sad.

Topic The Trump Tariffs
Posted 11 Jun 2018 09:11

After calling tariffs against Canada a matter of national security, Trump arrived late to the G7 and left early. He really did not want to be there and did nothing to add anything positive to the proceedings. He rated his relationship with PM Trudeau a ten and then called him weak and dishonest in a tweet tirade on the plane. His minions, Kudlow and Navarro, added insult to injury accusing Trudeau of betrayal and a stab in the back (Kudlow) and saying that there is a special place in hell for Trudeau (Navarro).

This was meant to show Trump's strength before the Korea summit, but has splintered the western coalition as they opt to carry on without the US and back Trudeau over Trump. Trudeau's response was measured and understated but he did assert that Canada would not be pushed around. He made no mention of the personal insults hurled at him.

Is Trump's fragile hold on reality disintegrating? Canada is a national security threat? Insults from him and his cabinet that would be the prelude to armed attacks in any other circumstance? He doesn't realize that he is playing into Putin's hands by undermining the NATO alliance, G7 and all of the other alliances of western democracies that have kept world peace since WWII. Exactly what Putin wants to reestablish his power in the world. The Chinese will sit back and watch it all gleefully.

Trudeau and Canada have nothing to apologize for. A comment in the NYTimes this morning summarized it better than I could:

Canadians fought and died beside U.S. forces in the First and Second World Wars; they fought and died beside U.S. forces again in the U.N action in Korea. Again, in Afghanistan. Canadian diplomats bravely sheltered U.S. citizens during the Iranian hostage crises, and played an integral role in their escape from that country, using Canadian passports supplied by our government. Decades later, Canadians opened their hearts and homes to thousands of U.S. citizens whose planes landed, primarily in Newfoundland and Nova Scotia, where familial and commercial bonds between the two nations have existed for generations. In short, the U.S. has not had a better ally or friend in its history. Have we benefited? Yes. But I doubt many people remain for long in relationships where there is not some measure of reciprocity. The weekend's comments, and the attitude they reveal towards Canada, are beneath contempt - all of them coming as your president heaps praise on two dictatorial thugs who rule their lands through brutality and a disdain for the rule of law. A special place in hell? Yeh - see you there, Mr. Navarro.

Topic No Collusion...
Posted 09 Jun 2018 09:38

Trump followers are willfully blind to all of this (and what has been outlined in the above post) and cry "fake news" when confronted with facts and truth. Of course they live in a world of delusion where truth is fake news and lies are alternate facts.

What is remarkable is that in all the months of the Mueller investigation there have been no leaks. We don't know anything until indictments are made public. He is proceeding methodically up the food chain to Trump and I have no doubt that some of the accused will flip and give evidence against him. Loyalty is a one-way street with Trump. No one will go to jail to save him. Even if he were to try to do an end run around the process by giving out pardons to all, that would only speak to his consciousness of guilt and bolster the charges of obstruction of justice against him.

No one is above the law. No one. Look at what happened with Watergate and Nixon. A minor politically motivated break-in ended up taking down a president. Eventually all of the threads will come together and Trump's misdeeds, self-dealing, lies and collusion with the Russians will be exposed. Maybe Putin will offer him a dacha on the Black Sea for his retirement as a thank you after he leaves office.

Topic Do you agree with Trump
Posted 08 Jun 2018 16:01

No. Trump is treating allies like enemies and enemies like allies. I wonder what is at the bottom of his sycophantic relationship to Putin. People have speculated that Trump owes Russian oligarchs hundreds of millions of dollars since more conventional banks would no longer lend him money. There are those who think that the Russians have other dirt on him or that he hero-worships Putin because Putin has unlimited power and has flattered him. Massaging Trump's ego is a way to get him on side. I guess history will reveal it all in some decades.

Allowing the Russians back into the group would undo any sanction their ouster accomplished. They have done nothing do redeem themselves and indeed have been interfering in elections in Europe, the UK and the US. A pass would indicate that they can do as they please without compunction or consequences.

Topic The Supreme Court Rulled in Favor of an Anti Gay Marriage Baker
Posted 07 Jun 2018 15:06

nearly every business has a right to turn down custom, now if a baker doesnt want to bake a cake for whatever reason, go to another baker that will.

to me, its that simple.

Simply wrong that is. Do you have any idea what civil rights legislation and human rights legislation are about? Just about every western democracy has some form of this.
You may not discriminate against individuals based on many different parameters and you may not discriminate against an entire group on similar criteria, such as ethnic group, colour, religion, and many others. What you suggest would bring back Jim Crow segregation in the US and similar odious situations in other countries.

Topic The Supreme Court Rulled in Favor of an Anti Gay Marriage Baker
Posted 06 Jun 2018 13:23

Isn't that the same kind of argument people made opposing same sex marriage: "gay people have exactly the same right to marry anyone from the opposite sex as straight people have"?

No. There is a difference in not providing a product to any customer - like pork in a halal or kosher butcher or an anti-gay cake from a baker - and not providing it to a particular customer, like the baker who would not provide the cake to the same sex couple because they purportedly offended his principles.

Topic The Supreme Court Rulled in Favor of an Anti Gay Marriage Baker
Posted 06 Jun 2018 09:33

This is what two justices (normally more liberal) said:

"Mr. Phillips made wedding cakes for opposite-sex couples but refused to do so for same-sex couples, denying same-sex couples full equality under state law; but bakers who refused to bake a cake “denigrating gay people and same-sex marriage” would not have baked such a cake for any customer — and therefore engaged in no denial of equal treatment."

Equal treatment is a core value of civil rights.

Topic Who is most likely to be subverting justice? The GOP or the Dems?
Posted 06 Jun 2018 08:34

1) Make up all kinds of crazy conspiracy theories about how corrupt the other side is.

2) Repeat the lies until the most ignorant part of the country doesn't even question them any more.

3) Get your party elected by playing to the side that believes your lies.

4) Abuse your power by citing your own lies about how the other side abused their power as precedent to excuse your own corruption.


It has been reported this morning that Trump is preparing to pardon dozens of people convicted of crimes. The pardons that he gave or announced in the past week sent political messages in that they all seemed to be related to the allegations building against him or those close to him and had connections to those he perceives as his enemies. Some had been prosecuted by James Comey or Preet Bharara, both of whom he fired. Bharara was at the Southern District of NY, where Michael Cohen is being investigated now. Some were related to political crimes, like Scooter Libby, an advisor to Bush and Cheney, who leaked information about Valerie Plame, a CIA operative, outing her. He was convicted of four counts (one count of obstruction of justice, two counts of perjury, and one count of making false statements). He hinted he would pardon Martha Stewart who was jailed for insider trading and lying to the FBI, and was prosecuted by Comey.

He is letting people in his orbit being investigated and indicted know that he will pardon them if they don't flip and incriminate him. I wonder if this flood of dozens of pardons will be construed as obstruction of justice and/or misuse of his executive power giving grounds for impeachment.

There was one pardon that corrected an injustice, a posthumous one for Jack Johnson, the first African-American heavyweight boxing champion, who had been convicted of taking his white girlfriend across state lines in 1913. The law was meant to prevent human trafficking but was used to condemn interracial relationships and punish African-Americans.

We will have to wait and see the list of potential recipients of pardons to understand what message Trump is sending.

Topic The person above you is a high school teacher. What do they teach?
Posted 04 Jun 2018 16:18

Art - with occasional modelling for life drawing classes

Topic The Supreme Court Rulled in Favor of an Anti Gay Marriage Baker
Posted 04 Jun 2018 13:15

Don’t see this ruling as a rebuke against the LGBTQI community. As Principessa pointed out, it’s a rebuke against the hostile language used by Colorado commission on civil rights towards the baker. The justices found that members of the commission made “official expressions of hostility to religion” during their deliberations on the case centering on Masterpiece Cakeshop and baker Jack Phillips. This was the violation of his first amendment right to freely practice his religion and why SCOTUS rulled in his favor. SCOTUS made no determination as to the constitutionality of the law in Colorado that protects LGBTQI people’s rights. And I think, in the majority opinion liberal and conservitive justices alike expressed the need to ensure gay and lesbian couples are treated with dignity in the marketplace. This perhaps telegraphs how they may rule in the next case they will hear involving, I think, a photographer who refused service to a gay couple.

I think the court opined that the Colorado commission had shown a hostility towards religion in approaching this case by their intemperate words, violating the principle of fairness requisite in administrative law. They perhaps could have ruled against Phillips without this contested language and it would have stood. So it is, I believe, the apprehension of bias that weighed against the commission, rather than their precise ruling. I realize that this is splitting hairs, but that is what is done in legal argument. I would not extrapolate from this that SCOTUS would sustain all manner of discrimination based on purported religious convictions. I have no doubt that this decision will be tested with different fact situations which will lack the animus of the Colorado commission. My own view is that the commission's language did not fatally taint the argument that Phillips had discriminated against these customers and SCOTUS was wrong.

Topic The Supreme Court Rulled in Favor of an Anti Gay Marriage Baker
Posted 04 Jun 2018 09:34

This is wrong, wrong, wrong. Although it seems that the Colorado commission did not approach the case fairly, a core principle of administrative law, SCOTUS has now made a greater error by siding with discrimination in the provision of goods and services to the public. When you open your business to the public, you are obliged to service all clients and customers regardless of race, religion or any of the other protected categories of discrimination. That is the deal when you get a license to open your business or hang your shingle to provide professional services. If you want to pick and choose, open a private club.

Will we now return to the era when hotels, restaurants and businesses refused Jews, blacks and others - now including the LGBTQ community which was closeted then? Will there be signs proclaiming those who are welcome and/or unwelcome? Even if the decision acknowledges that it should be read narrowly because of the animus of the Colorado commission, it opens the door to the closing of doors and will no doubt be tested not only by those against discrimination but also by those who wish to use their religion as a reason for shameless discrimination.

Freedom of religion does not give you the right to impose your religious values on others or subject them to a religious test in the provision of goods and services to the public. Both are unconstitutional.

I do have to add that the work of art argument is ridiculous. The baker does his job well. He sells his products to the public in the open marketplace. They are not museum pieces. By his argument any artisan who does good work could discriminate whether they were a baker or a bricklayer.

Edit: I just read this in an opinion piece in the NYTimes on contrition and it is apt here:

"You can safely assume that you’ve created God in your own image,” Anne Lamott famously pointed out, “when it turns out that God hates all the same people you do.”

Topic Did Samantha Bee Owe Ivanka an Apology
Posted 01 Jun 2018 14:16

The "grab 'em by the pussy" remark was not made in public.

Trump's not exactly a world class orator. He's a real estate developer. There are many instances where what he said was a bit ambiguous. "Fine people on both sides" of what, exactly? The haters, always going for the worst interpretation, decided he meant both sides of the riot. But they've also decided he called every immigrant, or every illegal immigrant, an animal. If you listen to the "animals" remark in context you realize the subject being discussed was MS-13 gang members. Hopefully you'll agree that decapitating teenage girls as an example to others would qualify someone for being called an animal.

As far as jailing Hillary Clinton, if she committed crimes, not just "gross negligence" in her mishandling of classified documents, why shouldn't she be in jail? Some of those documents were classified at the highest level the US Government has. And the laws regulating how they are to be handled have no allowance for lack of criminal intent. If she mishandled them, and we know she did, she's guilty of a Federal crime.

I assure you, if you or I had done what she did, we'd be locked up. Why do you think she deserved the special treatment she received?

I believe that she was entitled to due process and that it was determined that no charges be laid against her. That happens when prosecutors are not confident that they have enough evidence to prove their case beyond a reasonable doubt. You will counter that the system was skewed in her favour by the FBI and Justice Dept., but this is the same FBI that undercut her campaign before election day and same DOJ that seems to be populated by at least as many Republicans as Democrats.

As to Trump's remarks, it was clear on Charlottesville that he was drawing a moral equivalence between the neo-Nazis and those protesting them. You would have to turn yourself into a pretzel to interpret it another way. David Duke was grateful for this remark. Trump did nothing to walk it back.

You and I will never agree on any of this.

Topic Did Samantha Bee Owe Ivanka an Apology
Posted 01 Jun 2018 13:08

So if someone said it about Michelle Obama, you would be fine with it? Michelle Obama definately does not stay in the background.

I would be fine with them criticizing her. Not with them calling her a cunt, which is exactly what I said about Bee and Ivanka.

Topic Did Samantha Bee Owe Ivanka an Apology
Posted 01 Jun 2018 13:05

Perhaps a bigger question here is how does S. Bee have a "comedy" show and pass herself off as a "comedian" when she's not funny? If you examine the quote being discussed here, there's no joke there. There's nothing funny, nothing particularly clever, nothing at all except hurling vile invective at a target that she knows her audience hates, thus reinforcing their shallow, mindless hatred and earning brain-dead zombie howls of approval. It's masturbating for a crowd, taking pleasure in their mindless approval and their laughter at how "edgy" and "brave" she is. Or maybe they're all still in junior high and they find dirty words intensely funny. "Oooh, you said cunt!"

People that laugh just because someone throws around vile, offensive language with no other content that's remotely humorous are drones. A laugh track can perform the same function and not waste so much oxygen. I suppose, though, that as long as you mouth all of the right liberal pieties and only target people from "The Official List Of Persons We Hate", that just being hateful and using vile language is what qualifies as entertainment for the far left these days. Seriously; if you find this brand of "humor" funny you should probably have your IQ checked.

Then again, Biden, Slick Willie, and Harry Reid all got a free pass for saying some very stupid, racist things about Obama back in 2007-08. I guess if you say the right things and pretend to support the approved causes you can get away with saying almost anything with no fear of ever paying a price.

With respect, you should read your post again. You realize that everything you said about Samantha Bee could be said about Trump and his audience at any of his rallies. She has done nothing that he hasn't already done to the adulation of his followers. Remember the "grab 'em by the pussy"" remark? Remember the "fine people on both sides" after Charlottesville? Remember him promising to jail Clinton? I could go on and on with examples from the campaign and since he was elected with remarks about people, groups, and institutions that he has disrespected. Is it more seemly from an elected president? Are his followers any less in the thrall you described? Your last sentence particularly applies to Trump.

I hate the what- about argument, but it is apt in this case. Funny is in the eye (or ear) of the beholder, I guess.

Topic Did Samantha Bee Owe Ivanka an Apology
Posted 01 Jun 2018 11:27

Seax wrote:

Taking Ivanka on regarding her father's immigration policy and the 1500 missing children was fair game.

The usual definition of missing is that you don't know where someone or something is. I understand that a large proportion of these children may be with relatives or others that have stepped in to take care of them, but until this is confirmed, we don't know for certain where they are and with whom. The fear is that some may have fallen into the hands of human traffickers. Surely the US government has the resources to find them.

Topic Did Samantha Bee Owe Ivanka an Apology
Posted 01 Jun 2018 09:46

Remember that Ivanka is not in the background. She purportedly works in the White House. There is no comparison to other presidential offspring because they were removed from politics. She put herself in the political arena and all that comes with it. Being Trump's daughter does not give her immunity from criticism or ridicule because of that.

I think that "cunt" was unnecessary and inappropriate. Taking Ivanka on regarding her father's immigration policy and the 1500 missing children was fair game.

So, as I said before, an apology for the slur.

Topic Did Samantha Bee Owe Ivanka an Apology
Posted 31 May 2018 16:41

Only for the "C" word. The rest was fine including calling her feckless.

Topic Three Cheers for the New Roseanne!!
Posted 30 May 2018 13:08

Something like 4% of Americans are prescribed Ambien or the generic. You can bet that there are more that take it without a prescription. It is fairly easy to get mail order from one of your Canadian pharmacies. The warnings on the label indicate that the side effects can last well after the drowsiness wears off. Are some of those people at the rallies still under the influence of a sleep aid? I think you can assume some are. How many? That's probably unknowable without making them all pee in a cup. But be advised that the folks at any political rally are feeling similar side effects. What effect if any is consumption of mind altering chemicals, all of them, having on American politics? I have no idea. But I think we can all rest assured there are some.

indiscriminate discrimination => nice turn of a phrase!

By your information that accounts for less than 95% of them and assumes that everyone who was prescribed it had taken it, even if I disagree with this as an excuse. What's the excuse for the rest of them, or are you willing to admit that they're enthusiastically endorsing bigoted content spewing from Trump's mouth? I mentioned in another thread that I had seen documentary film of George Wallace in the 1968 campaign recently. The parallels in their appeals are striking.

In any event, my view is that this entire Ambien argument deflects away from the real issue of racism and bigotry displayed by Rosanne for many years and the orgiastic applause and refrains from Trump supporters for the same thing at his rallies. You have spent an awful lot of time explaining Ambien to us instead of addressing the environment created by Trump that has given life to this bigotry in public.

Ambien made me do it is like the dog ate my homework (and I don't know the Latin for that): a lame excuse for accepting the consequences of deeds and behaviour.

Firing Trump will not be as easy as it was for ABC to fire Rosanne. But it can begin by taking back some of the levers of power with the election of more Democrats in the fall.

(That sound is the mic being dropped by me.)

Topic Three Cheers for the New Roseanne!!
Posted 30 May 2018 11:47

I'm guessing that Lush really does need some kind of way to delineate sarcasm and/or humor. Nevermind!

"In wine there is truth" refers one effect of ethyl alcohol, the lessening or complete dropping of the filter that tell most people, "That's OK to think but you'd better bite your tongue before you say it." I was trying to point out that Ambien has a similar effect.

No, Ambien didn't make Roseanne Barr a racist, but it could have very well been the factor that led to her telling the twitterverse that she was.

Next topic. You've seen me use an ad hominem attack before. So they're something you've seen me stoop to. They're something I avoid unless in response to an ad hominem attack that is leveled against me. I don't believe you've seen me treat you in such a fashion. That certainly wasn't one.

We have certainly seen a bunch of folks on all sides of the USA's political spectrum suffer from "foot in mouth" disease of late. For instance, watch "The View" and take note of some of the abhorrent stuff routinely spouted by Joy Behar, or Whoopi Goldberg. And I'd be willing to bet you that Kathy Griffin wishes she could take back that Trump severed head "joke". Since it seems to be affecting just about everyone, I doubt Trump is the primary trigger. But I'm not ready to say that Ambien isn't.

Ambien did not make Rosanne a racist. There we agree. She exposed herself as a racist for years before this blew up yesterday, including the content of her tweets and conspiracy theories. She had already shown us who and what she is.

I do think that Trump has been a trigger for the loosening of many tongues, one that happened without any assist from Ambien. His indiscriminate discrimination voiced to the adulation of crowds at his rallies is there for all to see. Or do they all take Ambien the night before?

The Pandora's box of ill will that has been unleashed is unacceptable. Under any circumstances. I am not sure if the content of some people's hearts and characters are filled with hatred that their keeping quiet about it makes it better. It is only marginally better not to hear it all.