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Street "Admiration"

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Rainbow Warrior
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Quote by Verbal
#imaguyanddecidedtorespondanyway

I don't have the confidence to come on to a total stranger, and I would never catcall or whistle, but back in my NYC daze there was a line that, while corny, had a lot of truth in it and I was always tempted to use: "I saw you and you were so pretty I knew I would regret it if I didn't ask you out for a drink or a cup of coffee. Interested?" There are a lot of unapproachably pretty women in NYC, and I often contemplated going up to one and trying it out. I fell in love with strangers on the subway nearly daily.

Actually, I am confident enough to believe I could hold up my end of a scintillating conversation if any woman ever said yes. But I was always too scared to ask.

Would any of you ladies have said "yes" to that line, if asked politely?



If I found the guy physically attractive, that line would definitely work for me. The trouble with being unapproachably pretty is that you only get approached by overconfident alpha males, and while some women go for that type of machismo, I go for just the opposite-shy and self-effacing intellectuals. So the type of guy I would most enjoy being with never asks me because he's too scared of rejection. This fallacy works against pretty girls all the time, which is why so many pretty girls wind up with assholes.

I think the reason I became so aggressive and self-confident myself was because I knew I was missing out on all the great guys who were too shy to approach me, so I started approaching them! #wantonslut
Active Ink Slinger
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Most my friends think I am an Attention Slut and so I may see this category differently than many women.

We all know when a person is giving us more attention than the situation requires. I am not offended in the least and may even encourage it.

I know some women find such attention not only inappropriate but a cause for fear and if you are constructed in that manner I really do understand.

That is just not me and I do not expect it will ever be me.
Gravelly-Voiced Fucker
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Quote by BethanyFrasier



If I found the guy physically attractive, that line would definitely work for me. The trouble with being unapproachably pretty is that you only get approached by overconfident alpha males, and while some women go for that type of machismo, I go for just the opposite-shy and self-effacing intellectuals. So the type of guy I would most enjoy being with never asks me because he's too scared of rejection. This fallacy works against pretty girls all the time, which is why so many pretty girls wind up with assholes.

I think the reason I became so aggressive and self-confident myself was because I knew I was missing out on all the great guys who were too shy to approach me, so I started approaching them! #wantonslut


Too bad we never met up in NYC, back in the day smile. Though since I would have been too shy to ask, I guess it wouldn't have mattered.
Rainbow Warrior
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Quote by Verbal


Too bad we never met up in NYC, back in the day smile. Though since I would have been too shy to ask, I guess it wouldn't have mattered.



It may have been a near-miss if you were in NYC between 1999-2005. I was in New York about 20 times between those years! ;-)
"insensitive prick!" – Danielle Algo
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Quote by browncoffee
#doyouevenbelieveinGodanyway


#nah #saidgodnotGod #justanexpression


===  Not ALL LIVES MATTER until BLACK LIVES MATTER  ===

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Quote by WhoIsJohnGalt


Follow-up question: How would you describe the essential rules of etiquette for casual contact between strangers when one is attracted to the other?


Etiquette? Well, I would firstly expect them to be polite to each other. Like, 'hey, do you mind if I sit here, ask you something?' etc. If the person you're interested in engages in conversation, then cool. If they don't then don't push it. Just be natural, I guess. You should always treat people with kindness and respect.
"insensitive prick!" – Danielle Algo
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Isn't a big part of the problem that many 'admirers' expect a response? True admiration does not of course.
Like what if a guy came up to you and said something in the line of "I think you look smoking hot" and went on with his business, not expecting a response. Would that be OK? In a certain context perhaps?


===  Not ALL LIVES MATTER until BLACK LIVES MATTER  ===

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Quote by BethanyFrasier
I go for just the opposite-shy and self-effacing intellectuals.


Sigh. That describes me to a tee.XAweCXR32HmZkX9K Apparently, I grew up at the wrong time in the wrong place.8CbC77GC6mXECSCu Took me until grad school to find a woman who goes for my "type".
Empress of the Moon
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Ladies, there's been some well-publicized controversy lately about so-called "cat calls" from strangers. What's your opinion?

1. How do you feel about cat calls and other shouted or whistled "praise" and gestures from men you don't know?

It is frighting because it usually happens from guys who are in a group, and men in a group are dangerous especially if they are drinking. To be out running and have a car full of guys, or even one guy shout or catcall is scary, and to be followed by a group of men and hearing them behind me making compliments or rude remarks about my body or my ass infuriates me because it makes me feel like I am only a piece of meat on display.

2. How do you feel about cat calls and other shouted or whistled "praise" and gestures from women you don't know? (perhaps given as a joke or sincerely from lesbian or bisexual women)

Women aren't as scary as men.

3. How do you feel about quieter but still public forms of expressed "admiration" from men you don't know, such as unsolicited requests for attention, dates, phone numbers, etc.?

Someone saying things like, 'You look good today,' is fine. Following me around is not. Sending me flowers or gifts is scary too. I don't like unsolicited attention.

4. How do you feel about quieter but still public forms of expressed "admiration" from women you don't know, such as unsolicited requests for attention, dates, phone numbers, etc.? (perhaps given as a joke or sincerely from lesbian or bisexual women)

Pretty much the same. Women aren't as scary as men though, even in groups.

5. Have you ever cat called, shouted at or whistled at men or other women you didn't know?

No.

6. Have you ever given quieter, public forms of expressed "admiration" toward men or other women you didn't know?

Not directly. I've never walked up to a man I don't know and told them that they look great, although I have given compliments to women I don't know and smiled at men I thought looked good.
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Advanced Wordsmith
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Quote by Verbal
#imaguyanddecidedtorespondanyway

I don't have the confidence to come on to a total stranger, and I would never catcall or whistle, but back in my NYC daze there was a line that, while corny, had a lot of truth in it and I was always tempted to use: "I saw you and you were so pretty I knew I would regret it if I didn't ask you out for a drink or a cup of coffee. Interested?" There are a lot of unapproachably pretty women in NYC, and I often contemplated going up to one and trying it out. I fell in love with strangers on the subway nearly daily.

Actually, I am confident enough to believe I could hold up my end of a scintillating conversation if any woman ever said yes. But I was always too scared to ask.

Would any of you ladies have said "yes" to that line, if asked politely?


Thanks for saying this!
Advanced Wordsmith
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Quote by BethanyFrasier
The trouble with being unapproachably pretty is that you only get approached by overconfident alpha males...

Huh. I always thought the unapproachable attitude was specifically calculated to filter out the beta channel and get a pure alpha stream. So you're saying that's not the intent of all the women who do it?

I think the reason I became so aggressive and self-confident myself was because I knew I was missing out on all the great guys who were too shy to approach me, so I started approaching them! #wantonslut

I like your approach! How is it working?
Advanced Wordsmith
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Quote by 1nympholes
Most my friends think I am an Attention Slut and so I may see this category differently than many women.

We all know when a person is giving us more attention than the situation requires. I am not offended in the least and may even encourage it.

I know some women find such attention not only inappropriate but a cause for fear and if you are constructed in that manner I really do understand.

That is just not me and I do not expect it will ever be me.


Thank you very much for expressing yourself on this topic! May I ask--do you know others who share your view or do you think you're alone in this opinion? And are there ways of giving you public attention that go too far or are all expressions encouraged and appreciated? Does it ever strike you that by encouraging this behavior in men you may be encouraging them to behave in ways that scare other women?
Advanced Wordsmith
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Quote by browncoffee


Etiquette? Well, I would firstly expect them to be polite to each other. Like, 'hey, do you mind if I sit here, ask you something?' etc. If the person you're interested in engages in conversation, then cool. If they don't then don't push it. Just be natural, I guess. You should always treat people with kindness and respect.


Thank you!
Advanced Wordsmith
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One of the concepts I've been hoping to get at in this thread is the idea of an "unwanted sexual advance," which bridges both street harassment and workplace harassment.
The problem seems to occur wherever there are clubs and bars, college campuses, chat rooms--wherever people meet. To me, this broadens the issue out beyond construction site wolf-whistling.

For many, the unwanted sexual advance seems to be rooted in a breach of etiquette in which the person making the advance has failed to see or has ignored a social signal that an advance is not welcome. Or perhaps they have mistook a "stop" sign for a "go" signal.

I wondered if anyone is willing to attempt to articulate what these stop and go signals look like and how they differ from each other?


Perhaps people who commit this faux pas are unable to differentiate between the different social signals? Are they lacking training or social instincts?

Is this problem exclusive to straight men?

Or perhaps they lack the motivation to differentiate and respond appropriately, being somewhat blinded by the objective of the sexual advance or by their own ego?



Or is this behavior even an unwanted sexual advance in the first place? Are these individuals just posing and showing off for each other with no real attempt to give attention or show admiration to women?
Advanced Wordsmith
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Quote by noll
Isn't a big part of the problem that many 'admirers' expect a response? True admiration does not of course.
Like what if a guy came up to you and said something in the line of "I think you look smoking hot" and went on with his business, not expecting a response. Would that be OK? In a certain context perhaps?


Very interesting point. What kind of response do you think is expected?
Advanced Wordsmith
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Thank you for your response, Ruthie! (Sorry to hear about some of your more alarming responses, though.) Do you mind if I ask some follow-up questions?

Quote by Ruthie
I don't like unsolicited attention....Women aren't as scary as men...I've never walked up to a man I don't know and told them that they look great, although I have given compliments to women I don't know and smiled at men I thought looked good.


If we follow the implications here (men = scarier; solicited attention = preferable; etc.), it sounds like women generally feel frightened when men they don't know approach them, unless they have approached the man first. Yet I don't think most women feel comfortable breaking the ice with men--I think it's taboo in most of the world for women to approach a man they don't know. Am I the only one who sees the dilemma?
Rainbow Warrior
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Quote by WhoIsJohnGalt

Huh. I always thought the unapproachable attitude was specifically calculated to filter out the beta channel and get a pure alpha stream. So you're saying that's not the intent of all the women who do it?


Verbal was talking about unapproachable looks, not attitude. Some women are just so attractive, men feel they have no chance whatsoever with them.



Quote by WhoIsJohnGalt
I like your approach! How is it working?


I've always been very comfortable around guys, so I can bring them out of their shell when they're shy.
Advanced Wordsmith
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Quote by BethanyFrasier

Verbal was talking about unapproachable looks, not attitude. Some women are just so attractive, men feel they have no chance whatsoever with them.

I see. Thanks for the clarification. I must have incorrectly assumed that the looks and the attitude together were created to get the desired outcome. I guess you're saying some women just have those looks and can't make themselves more approachable no matter what they do?

I've always been very comfortable around guys, so I can bring them out of their shell when they're shy.

You have a wonderful gift!
Active Ink Slinger
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Quote by WhoIsJohnGalt


Thank you very much for expressing yourself on this topic! May I ask--do you know others who share your view or do you think you're alone in this opinion? And are there ways of giving you public attention that go too far or are all expressions encouraged and appreciated? Does it ever strike you that by encouraging this behavior in men you may be encouraging them to behave in ways that scare other women?


John I had never thought of my actions in that light but you could be right. I am very confident I am told and I was trained my a former Seal Commander. Therefore I am sure I can handle most anything that may come along.

I guess not every woman can wear this shoe. Sorry if I have over stepped.
Active Ink Slinger
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John Galt, most likely you received positive responses from more sexually liberal woman who are confident in there sexuality and have little fear of strange men. Like me and a couple of others who commented in a more positive way.
Her Royal Spriteness
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Quote by Verbal
#imaguyanddecidedtorespondanyway

I don't have the confidence to come on to a total stranger, and I would never catcall or whistle, but back in my NYC daze there was a line that, while corny, had a lot of truth in it and I was always tempted to use: "I saw you and you were so pretty I knew I would regret it if I didn't ask you out for a drink or a cup of coffee. Interested?" There are a lot of unapproachably pretty women in NYC, and I often contemplated going up to one and trying it out. I fell in love with strangers on the subway nearly daily.

Actually, I am confident enough to believe I could hold up my end of a scintillating conversation if any woman ever said yes. But I was always too scared to ask.

Would any of you ladies have said "yes" to that line, if asked politely?


would you be holding a huge handful of cash at the time? cause that would sway me.

honestly? it all depends on the setting, the mood, the vibe from the person. most likely not, but i wouldn't say never if i thought it sincere. that said, my wife might take exception to it if we're together. actually, if we were together, you'd probably be asking her and ignoring me.

#suckstobemarriedtosomeonehotterthanme #thirdwheel #i'dtotallyusethatlineonhannah

You can’t truly call yourself peaceful unless you are capable of violence. If you’re not capable of violence, you’re not peaceful. You’re harmless.

Gravelly-Voiced Fucker
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Quote by BethanyFrasier


Verbal was talking about unapproachable looks, not attitude. Some women are just so attractive, men feel they have no chance whatsoever with them.



Yeah. If I had met Layla at a party, I would have assumed I had no shot. Thank God for Lush!
"insensitive prick!" – Danielle Algo
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Quote by WhoIsJohnGalt
Very interesting point. What kind of response do you think is expected?


I believe many men who express their street admiration expect at least some response, and perhaps even a positive one if they truly believe their admiration should be considered a compliment. Some even get angry if the object of their admiration doesn't respond positively.


===  Not ALL LIVES MATTER until BLACK LIVES MATTER  ===

Gravelly-Voiced Fucker
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Quote by sprite


would you be holding a huge handful of cash at the time? cause that would sway me.

honestly? it all depends on the setting, the mood, the vibe from the person. most likely not, but i wouldn't say never if i thought it sincere. that said, my wife might take exception to it if we're together. actually, if we were together, you'd probably be asking her and ignoring me.

#suckstobemarriedtosomeonehotterthanme #thirdwheel #i'dtotallyusethatlineonhannah


Excuse me, but could your wife, who is very hot but not as hot as you, hold this gigantic bag of cash while I tell you sincerely that I couldn't forgive myself if I didn't ask you if you'd like to go out for a cup of coffee?
Advanced Wordsmith
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Quote by 1nympholes
John I had never thought of my actions in that light but you could be right...I guess not every woman can wear this shoe. Sorry if I have over stepped.


I have no idea whether my hypothesis is correct or not, I'm just throwing it out there as a possibility for discussion.

John Galt, most likely you received positive responses from more sexually liberal woman who are confident in there sexuality and have little fear of strange men. Like me and a couple of others who commented in a more positive way.


Huh. I'd like to know more about "sexually liberal women." I would like to know more such women - on this site and elsewhere.
Advanced Wordsmith
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Thank you for expressing your opinion, sprite! I identify with your self-deprecating nature, although I wish more self-confidence for us both!
Advanced Wordsmith
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Quote by Verbal
Excuse me, but could your wife, who is very hot but not as hot as you, hold this gigantic bag of cash while I tell you sincerely that I couldn't forgive myself if I didn't ask you if you'd like to go out for a cup of coffee?

I'll have this engraved "Mr. Smooth"
Advanced Wordsmith
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Quote by noll
I believe many men who express their street admiration expect at least some response, and perhaps even a positive one if they truly believe their admiration should be considered a compliment.


I can agree with this statement. I'm wondering what you would say they/we expect the form of that positive response to be? Eye contact? A smile? A positive comment back? Do you think men expect a woman to walk over, give him her phone number, whisper a sweet nothing in his ear, flash him a little private peek and invite him to her place?

Some even get angry if the object of their admiration doesn't respond positively.


I think there's probably some truth in this, too. Although I think the degree of truth ranges from a grain of frustration in a few men to a rare cumulative ball of rage.

On the whole, I think the majority of men who cat call consider it kind of a game to see if they can get any response at all. Some of them feel pressured into it by other men and haven't given the least thought toward the women at all; they're only thinking about how they fit into the male social order. Most probably actually do feel some attraction toward the women they're drawing attention to but are at a loss for a better way to approach them given the brevity of the encounter and the literal distance between them. So they fall back on what they've witnessed other men doing and rationalize that it's no worse than what they've seen in other situations. "Besides," they tell themselves, "If she's not flattered, that's her problem," or, "If she has a sense of humor, she'll think it's funny."

When they do get a positive response from a woman, I think they're almost always shocked and pleasantly surprised and don't know what to do with it. So if you want to see a cat-caller completely thrown off his game and teased relentlessly by his buddies, smile and wink at him while walking away.

And I don't think more than one man in a thousand has ever considered that their comment could make a woman feel threatened or unsafe. Especially when there are other people around and more than an arm's length between the two of them.
Gravelly-Voiced Fucker
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Quote by WhoIsJohnGalt

I'll have this engraved "Mr. Smooth"


It's a burden, really, being this smooth.
Active Ink Slinger
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1. How do you feel about cat calls and other shouted or whistled "praise" and gestures from men you don't know?

They are extremely annoying.

2. How do you feel about cat calls and other shouted or whistled "praise" and gestures from women you don't know? (perhaps given as a joke or sincerely from lesbian or bisexual women)

See above.

3. How do you feel about quieter but still public forms of expressed "admiration" from men you don't know, such as unsolicited requests for attention, dates, phone numbers, etc.?

I'm okay with this until they respect the first "no". If I have to repeat it, I know I'm dealing with an idiot.

4. How do you feel about quieter but still public forms of expressed "admiration" from women you don't know, such as unsolicited requests for attention, dates, phone numbers, etc.? (perhaps given as a joke or sincerely from lesbian or bisexual women)

Same.

5. Have you ever cat called, shouted at or whistled at men or other women you didn't know?

No.

6. Have you ever given quieter, public forms of expressed "admiration" toward men or other women you didn't know?

Yes, once, when I was drunk. I felt really bad about it in the morning.