I'm so fucking tired of idiots who think they're intellectuals.
Nails on a fucking chalkboard when you speak. Ugh.
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Dani
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Big-haired Bitch/Personality Hire
Quote by Richard8
Feminism today is a collectivist movement. I'm not going to elaborate, it's in my previous posts and with context.
Except it's not.
There is no context. Just lots of talking in circles and even fear mongering in regards to you mistaking being treated equal for being treated special.
You keep saying 'ignore the morons'.
I've said it before, when the same 'morons' we're meant to ignore are making laws and policies on our behalf, hiring, being members of admissions committees, or are otherwise integral to our livelihoods, how exactly do we go about avoiding/ignoring them?
You're advocating more for us to change when unequal systems need to change.
Big-haired Bitch/Personality Hire
Quote by miketabcdefg
My only problem with feminism is the word. I'd prefer egalitarian, with a focus on gender equality perhaps. But I'm a pedant like that. Should there also be masculinism for those few areas that are skewed the other way, or transgenderism or homosexualism. So again, for me gender equality in the midst of a wider focus on egalitarianism is enough but I can't deny there is empowerment in belonging to a cause and so perhaps the term feminism serves a purpose there, a purpose that for some has been met and they no longer need the word but certainly not for all, and, world wide, no where near a majority.
...Just looked up the terms. It seems masculinism does exist - for men's rights, sometimes masculism. Transgenderism exists for seeking rights for transgenders, but homosexualism simply describes the state of being homosexual (one website described it as the teachings and indoctrination of homosexuality - lol) It seems the terms aren't used enough to have solid meanings, but even so, the English language can be a daft thing sometimes.
I agree.
I think feminism and all the other isms are all subsets of egalitarianism. Therefore, you can be more than one simultaneously. And advocating for the equal rights of one group doesn't mean a call for less rights of another...or more rights than another.
As a whole, I too consider myself an egalitarian.
Big-haired Bitch/Personality Hire
Quote by Richard8
I did not say that I'm being stopped from speaking. I said that I won't be appreciated.
This extreme form of feminism that you draw distinction from, where do you think it has its roots?
Feminism in any form implicitly advocates the position of women as a special class of people. It's as simple as that. The reason I keep focusing on the extreme form is because it is the one having a larger impact than the rudimentary form that you say is okay.
And I repeat. The solution lies in the protection of those affected by gender bias and NOT in the promotion of a class of individuals.
The fact that feminism is a collectivist movement isn't an a feature of extremism. It is the very nature of the movement.
How can I use the extreme form against the simple form? I repeat - the simple form is the philosophically flawed root of the extreme form. What is the flaw? it's a collectivism asking for distinction.
If someone is treating a women with inequality, why should a woman aspire to deal with that moron? Why would anybody?
And there lies the answer. If everyone acknowledges these morons to be morons and not deal with them, the morons will fade away.
I'm fully aware that I might now be accused of equivocation. But there's a big difference between 'seeking equal treatment' and 'protecting from injustice'. The former is fertile soil for misuse. That's what's happening and that's why I'm not for it.
How can the latter even work, if everyone is occupied with the former?
Scroll the page and see for yourself. Wait for the thread to grow and do the math.
Finally, if you and anyone in this thread has felt discomfiture from my arguments, then ask yourselves, is it because I'm saying something that's unreasonable or is it because I'm putting an Identity under the scanner.
If it's the latter, then that's evidence of the collectivist bog superseding the individual.
I summarize - prevent injustice, persecute the moron, shun the moron. Period.
Feminism entails more than being mad because morons are being mean. That simplification is beyond insulting. And said morons can't be avoided when they're hiring you, signing your paycheck, are on admissions boards, are making up/expected to uphold institutional policies, etc.
I've felt discomfiture from your arguments because you've said many things that are unreasonable.
I take your meaning quite well, but I disagree with it. If you take someone disagreeing with you as 'not being appreciated', then that reveals all I need to know about you.
You're clinging to one argument, which is fine. But it's really not working in your favor. End of.
Big-haired Bitch/Personality Hire
Quote by Richard8
I'm copy pasting a reply given elsewhere, for the sake of clarity and consistency.
"I agree with the systemic flu that you're referring to, but I invite you to think, is present day feminism restricted to just that? The answer to that flu is protection from injustice or use of force but NOT throwing women under a different light. Are you seriously telling me that this isn't happening in the name of feminism?
I don't even want to mention the 'feminists' who go about bashing the male gender and start collectivists movements! That's what is really wrong with feminism - it has turned into a form of collectivism!
And as with any collectivist movement, the individual is superseded by an imagined higher power - in this case the female gender.
Do you deny that this is happening?
And in your quote you say "We'd like to be given those things regardless of gender"
Who is "we" ? = women.
'We women would like to be given those things regardless of us being women'.
Can you not see the contradiction?
I'm not a misogynist! But the feminist movement is not philosophically sound. I wish I could articulate my position better, but I don't think it'll be appreciated here, so I'm just going to leave it at that."
I don't deny that there are different forms of feminism. No movement is restricted to just one facet. I'm not sure why feminism should be any different.
I've already explained the form of feminism that I subscribe to.
I find nothing contradictory in the statement that 'We women would like to be given those things regardless of being women' because women indeed should be afforded the same opportunities as men so long as they qualify for those opportunities in the same capacity as men.
You keep veering off to the more extreme sector(s) of feminism as if it's the only form that exists while disregarding the rational and fair side of it. Every movement has its extremists that can cause damage to said movement and society as a whole, but it doesn't make said movement inherently bad or unnecessary.
No one's stopping you from articulating your position, as you've had ample opportunity to do so and you still have ample opportunity to do so.
It's just that every counterpoint you've had in terms of feminism has been in regard to an extreme form of it, and it's always been along the lines of 'What about those women that hate men and wanna be superior?!' Well, what about them? Sure they suck and make it hard for some of us, but it doesn't mean that feminism should be generalized away simply because the mean ones who wanna turn men into boot-lickers are ruining all the happy fun times that go along with gaining equality. I understand that only referring to this form of feminists makes it easier to denounce feminism as a whole. But arguing the very extreme side instead of taking a more holistic viewpoint is only doing yourself a disservice.
How can feminist extremists be used as an argument against me or anyone else you've exchanged words with in this thread when everyone who has disagreed with you thus far (men included) has expressed that they're in support of feminists who subscribe to the 'fair and equal for all' school of thought when it comes to feminism?
Do you think that currently, women are treated fairly and equally to their male counterparts? And by counterparts, I mean equal in every capacity (except gender, obviously). If you do, you're sorely mistaken. Because we're not, and that's why feminism needs to exist.
Big-haired Bitch/Personality Hire
Quote by Richard8
I'm copy-pasting a response I gave elsewhere.
An individual ought to be given the bare minimum respect, courtesy and acknowledgement. The rest of it has to be earned. Does feminism advocate that? No. It advocates equality to women merely BECAUSE they are women.
Are all men treated the same?
By demanding an individual to be given opportunity, attention and regard solely based on gender is not rational.
The only tenet of feminism I agree with is that women ought to be 'left alone' and 'let them be' - seeing them as 'inferior' merely because of gender is just primitive; acting on it and using force is worse.
Feminism does not ask to be given opportunity, attention, and regard solely based on gender. We'd like to be given those things regardless of gender, or basically in the same capacity as our male counterparts.
Men and women are treated differently based on their skills, education, experience, economic status, criminal records, etc.
I'd like to be regarded exactly the same as any male with my level of skill, education, experience, etc. Not better. Not special. Just equal.
We're not speaking of every day circumstances that none of us can control. We're speaking of systematic, institutional things that can most definitely be controlled.
Big-haired Bitch/Personality Hire
Quote by Richard8
Women ought not to given special treatment. If someone is demeaning an individual just because of her gender, then that's just sad and primitive.
But, it doesn't licence women to go about championing themselves and throwing themselves under special light.
Women have the freedom to not deal with people who are dumb. But just because dumb people exists, it doesn't mean that women can start a collectivist movement and run agendas.
Do you now see why the term 'feminazis' has come into existence?
Nothing you've just said has anything to do with feminism.
It's as simple as wanting to be seen/treated equal to men.
The term 'feminazis' came into existence to refer to those women who don't just want female equality but female superiority. Big difference.
Big-haired Bitch/Personality Hire
Quote by daddydavej
Uploading a picture? You mean like we already do to add to the photo albums?
Exactly.
You mentioned how being able to upload pictures would be simpler than copying and pasting image URLs. It's not. There are more steps involved.
Not to mention the damage it would do to our servers to be able to continuously upload images to the site via chat rooms. I believe that became a perk for Premium memberships for a reason.
Big-haired Bitch/Personality Hire
If you have apprehensions about getting more than a little rough or generally adventurous in terms of sex, a relationship with me won't work.
I don't need it rough all the time. Not even most of the time.
But he has to know the right time to be sweet and the right time to just grab my hair, bend me over, and fuck me within an inch of my life...among other things.
You'd be surprised how many guys aren't into that sort of thing and are into just very basic (hate the term 'vanilla') sex. There are those that are more than willing to adapt though, which is great. After that, it's all about balance.
I love trying new things and exploring my limits. Yes there will always be some middle ground. But sometimes I'm just like "Fuck that...just fuck me!"
I don't need it rough all the time. Not even most of the time.
But he has to know the right time to be sweet and the right time to just grab my hair, bend me over, and fuck me within an inch of my life...among other things.
You'd be surprised how many guys aren't into that sort of thing and are into just very basic (hate the term 'vanilla') sex. There are those that are more than willing to adapt though, which is great. After that, it's all about balance.
I love trying new things and exploring my limits. Yes there will always be some middle ground. But sometimes I'm just like "Fuck that...just fuck me!"
Big-haired Bitch/Personality Hire
Quote by daddydavej
Would an "add picture" button on the chat room menu not be just a lot simpler?
Probably not.
Something like that would probably require uploading a picture. So that's just adding steps.
Google (or any search engine of your choosing), right click, copy & paste. If the image is uploaded elsewhere, all you need to do is copy and paste the link.
Big-haired Bitch/Personality Hire
Quote by patokl
I am not aware of having anything more than a free membership, yet I seem to have access to all the features bronze offers. Am I overlooking something or am I an anomaly?
You were a published author prior to 01/01/2015, and therefore you were grandfathered in with a lifetime Bronze membership.